Code 007 isolation

[Mikec265]

As you can see in the title and picture, "code 007 battery isolation".

I have a laptop, but still need to buy the cables to hook it up to my bike.

Is there anything I can do before the cables are ordered and able to be used for multi tool?

 

[Mark911]

Be very careful with that one. Isolation refers to the physical separation (in terms of resistance/ohms) between the high voltage electronics/electrical system and the low voltage system. Ideally, you want the two to be completely isolated from each other. In practice the Alta typically maintains about 4-6 megohms resistance. This is achieved by using things like transformers and photoisolator components between systems when it's necessary for them to talk to each other and it's a major safety feature. If you are seeing a battery isolation fault it's because the "self test" electronics built into your bike have determined there's a compromise (voltage leak) between the two systems somewhere inside the battery pack. I'm not 100% sure of the minimum resistance that'll trigger a fault, but it's probably around 2 megohms. That's still pretty high from a safety standpoint (you wont get shocked), but it's indicative that things are going bad and could get worse if not addressed. There are ways to measure the resistance between Batt +/- terminals and bus ground but you need to know exactly what you're doing.

 

[#76]

Is this the same bike with the Code 35 back in 2019?...

Code 35

I went to check the hours on my bike today. Pressed the wrong button and a code 35 popped up. Is this a big deal, and should I do anything about it?

altaownersforum.com

 

[Mikec265]

Is this the same bike with the Code 35 back in 2019?...

Code 35

I went to check the hours on my bike today. Pressed the wrong button and a code 35 popped up. Is this a big deal, and should I do anything about it?

altaownersforum.com

Yes it is.

 

[Mikec265]

Be very careful with that one. Isolation refers to the physical separation (in terms of resistance/ohms) between the high voltage electronics/electrical system and the low voltage system. Ideally, you want the two to be completely isolated from each other. In practice the Alta typically maintains about 4-6 megohms resistance. This is achieved by using things like transformers and photoisolator components between systems when it's necessary for them to talk to each other and it's a major safety feature. If you are seeing a battery isolation fault it's because the "self test" electronics built into your bike have determined there's a compromise (voltage leak) between the two systems somewhere inside the battery pack. I'm not 100% sure of the minimum resistance that'll trigger a fault, but it's probably around 2 megohms. That's still pretty high from a safety standpoint (you wont get shocked), but it's indicative that things are going bad and could get worse if not addressed. There are ways to measure the resistance between Batt +/- terminals and bus ground but you need to know exactly what you're doing.

Thanks Mark. This sounds like it is way beyond my capabilities to fix myself. I was afraid this day would come. I'm pretty mechanically inclined, but electrical stuff like this is beyond me.

 

[Mikec265]

Just ordered the can-usb adapter.
BUT I can't order the other cable due to a server error. Ran into the same problem trying to order a front fender bracket a couple days ago

 

[snydes]

@Mikec265 , Contact @OneLapper directly on the cable, I’m sure he can get you sorted out.

Someone correct me off I’m wrong, but I think these faults are typically in the top covers, which isn’t terrible to replace and we have most of those parts available.

 

[Rashid510]

Code 007 is related specifically to the loss of isolation across the charging system = (charger - DCCP harness - DCCP)

Beyond getting MT on the bike I would highly recommend checking the charger, the DCCP and harness. The DCCP is a box in the front bulkhead. It has connections to the battery and the inverter. Potentially moisture/water may have gotten into there.

 

[snydes]

Just for reference

New to me 2017 MX... Code 33 / 007 charging fault...

Hello all! So glad this forum exists thank you for everything in advance! I came across a deal I could not pass up. I bought a 2017 MX(vin 039) only 100 miles, but with some charging problems. I have the Multitool cables on order, and I've been reading up on all that should be fun... Anyway...

altaownersforum.com

 

[Mark911]

Code 007 is related specifically to the loss of isolation across the charging system = (charger - DCCP harness - DCCP)

Beyond getting MT on the bike I would highly recommend checking the charger, the DCCP and harness. The DCCP is a box in the front bulkhead. It has connections to the battery and the inverter. Potentially moisture/water may have gotten into there.

Oh yes, I didn't even notice the fault occurred during charging, thanks Raakesh for helping "isolate" haha, the problem. The DCCP has two wires that carry the hi voltage (+/-) from the charge port (charger connected) down to the inverter where they're ultimately connected to Bus +/- at the large power capacitor studs. When charging current flows from the charger through the two relays inside the DCCP (one for + and one for -) to the inverter then through the hi-voltage (orange) cable to the battery pack connector through the contactors (one for + and one for -) and onto the physical connections to packs modules. The DCCP will not close its relays unless conditions are proper for charging. Same with the contactors inside the pack. If either system sees a potential isolation issue it'll open up the relays and stop any further charging. The DCCP uses it's relays as the main isolation mechanism since they are essentially transformers and electromagnetic in nature. The contactors are also highly isolative by design but if the fault only occurs during charging I'd rule them out. As Raakesh pointed out, the high voltage cable from inverter to pack can occasional cause problems if moisture finds its way into the wrong areas. Again, if it's only an issue during charging I'd look elsewhere (unless the problem occurred relatively soon after the bike saw water).

To me, I'd say (assuming another known good charger doesn't help) that the issue is with the DCCP. Possibly one of the relays is slowly failing, allowing a bit of current flow between the control coil (low v) and hi voltage switch. Another possible leak might be the actual isolation detecting safety circuitry itself. The self test feature within the DCCP measures the voltage drop across several very high resistance precision resistors connecting hi v and low v circuits. A failed precision resistor could cause an isolation fault.

 

[Mikec265]

Just started seeing code 33 today. Didn't notice it last night.
Also I tried both my chargers (fast and slow ones).
Picking up a new GasGas MC 450 today to ease the pain.

 

[Mikec265]

Officially waiting for both cables to arrive.

I'm not as excited about a new 450 as I should be. The Alta is just that good of a bike!

Went from the easiest bike to change a shock spring, to the strangest. My first KTMish bike.

 

[snydes]

Haha! Holy moley! Nothing like tearing a brand new bike to pieces! I wouldn’t loose too much sleep over the Alta problems. Sounds like it’s resolvable, just have to be patient.

 

[Trialsman]

That's the way to do it! I had 6mi on my new Moto Guzzi V85TT when I tore it down. I did find dry steering head bearings. I tore apart my Altas also. This is where I found out the spectacular attention to detail the factory did assembling these bikes. The Alta was the best I have every seen on any brand.

 

[Oded]

These new Gasgas should be great. They are actually re branded KTM with some mods to make them a little less expensive.
Very good value for money.

 

[Judaslefourbe]

The Alta was the best I have every seen on any brand.

Thanks for the kind words. We tried our best and it is nice reading this.

 

[Mikec265]

These new Gasgas should be great. They are actually re branded KTM with some mods to make them a little less expensive.
Very good value for money.

$8850 otd. I can't believe I didn't have to pay retail of $9399 plus fees. I didn't hesitate to say "sold" on the phone considering the current market. Point View Cycle in Ohio was awesome to deal with! Worth the drive.

 

[Mikec265]

That's the way to do it! I had 6mi on my new Moto Guzzi V85TT when I tore it down. I did find dry steering head bearings. I tore apart my Altas also. This is where I found out the spectacular attention to detail the factory did assembling these bikes. The Alta was the best I have every seen on any brand.

Yes, best built bike from the factory I have ever owned by far! Every time I had to do basic maintenance for the first time I was impressed with the build quality. I believe a 2nd gen Alta would have been absolutely flawless had they stayed in business.

 

[Mikec265]

Bike has been sitting until just now. Seems to be charging fine. I think moisture got in somewhere and it dried out sitting in my hot dry garage from the first post until now.

As much as I love this bike, I'm going to put it up for sale. I have a complete set of factory take off plastic, new subframe, new seat, new unboxed wheel set, display, Alta vault, laptop and cables, extra throttle, extra map switch, fast and slow chargers, and probably forgetting more.

Suspension revalved/sprung for 220 pound B motocross ( I have the stock spring and a super stiff 7.0 spring plus the right spring on the bike for a 220 lb rider)

Serial # 372

Could use a front fender bracket.

It has been showing code 35 when you press and hold the middle button on the display. Been riding it for a long time like that.

1650 miles
156 hours

I need to hook the laptop up and see what it says. Just took off the charger and code 33/35 still show. Not sure if the code 33 needs to be cleared or if it should go away on its own. Seems to be working fine, but waiting for a full charge.

What's it worth if I got rid of everything as a package deal? Best/worst case.
Whomever I sell it to, I just want to be honest and up front about it.

 

[Mikec265]

Got a full charge, but Still flashing code 33.