Question about Stark charger 240v adapter: is neutral required?

[AL_V]

I understand the Stark charger is the same as the Alta charger (please correct me if that is not the case).
A nema 6-50 receptacle used for a 240v welder has no neutral, only L1, L2, and ground.
So, I can make an adapter 6-50p to L14-30r, which will have no neutral.
Will this work with the Stark charger, or does it need a neutral?
THANKS!

 

[Rashid510]

Not exactly sure where the info the Alta charger is the same (photos help) but if the charger is looking for a neutral signal, it may not connect.

 

[AL_V]

Not exactly sure where the info the Alta charger is the same (photos help) but if the charger is looking for a neutral signal, it may not connect.

Thanks, exactly what I was thinking…,

 

[AL_V]

Not exactly sure where the info the Alta charger is the same (photos help) but if the charger is looking for a neutral signal, it may not connect.

Ok, for now, can you tell me if the Alta charger would work without a neutral?

 

[rayivers]

Stark makes two chargers: one for the EU etc., and another for Australia (220V 50Hz, no neutral). I can't see either one requiring a neutral connection for 220-240V operation.

 

[fsfs]

Stark makes two chargers: one for the EU etc., and another for Australia (220V 50Hz, no neutral). I can't see either one requiring a neutral connection for 220-240V operation.

There is only one charger.

For 3.3kW the charger wants 220 - 240V range. It does not care if you are in Europe and have 230V with respect to neutral and earth or in the USA and have 240V center tapped. All it wants is 220 - 230VAC. Remember, in Europe there is no hot and neutral. When you push the plug into the socket it is random as to which side is hot and neutral.

 

[AL_V]

There is only one charger.

For 3.3kW the charger wants 220 - 240V range. It does not care if you are in Europe and have 230V with respect to neutral and earth or in the USA and have 240V center tapped. All it wants is 220 - 230VAC. Remember, in Europe there is no hot and neutral. When you push the plug into the socket it is random as to which side is hot and neutral.

Thank you sir, so the answer to my original question is that the charger will work in the US with L1, L2, and ground, and no neutral, correct?
And is it possible for the Stark charger to function on 120V (20amps), even knowing it will be very slow?

 

[fsfs]

Thank you sir, so the answer to my original question is that the charger will work in the US with L1, L2, and ground, and no neutral, correct?
And is it possible for the Stark charger to function on 120V (20amps), even knowing it will be very slow?

First question, yes. Correct.
Second question. It will work on 110V and draw about 15A, so power draw just above 1.6kW.

 

[AL_V]

First question, yes. Correct.
Second question. It will work on 110V and draw about 15A, so power draw just above 1.6kW.

Thanks again! Now back to waiting for my bike.....

 

[AL_V]

There is only one charger.

For 3.3kW the charger wants 220 - 240V range. It does not care if you are in Europe and have 230V with respect to neutral and earth or in the USA and have 240V center tapped. All it wants is 220 - 230VAC. Remember, in Europe there is no hot and neutral. When you push the plug into the socket it is random as to which side is hot and neutral.

@fsfs, Stark shows 3 different chargers with different part numbers.
Perhaps the actual plug is the only difference?

 

[dpwracing]

First question, yes. Correct.
Second question. It will work on 110V and draw about 15A, so power draw just above 1.6kW.

I was only seeing ~8.5 amps max on a 110V with the Stark-supplied US charging cable (swapped out the 14-30 since I don't have that outlet at my house). Also, the charging setting on the phone amp max'd at 10 amps. Maybe I'm missing something? Based on the charging rate, I estimated 4 - 5 hours to fully charge from 0%.

 

[fsfs]

@fsfs, Stark shows 3 different chargers with different part numbers.
Perhaps the actual plug is the only difference?
View attachment 10511

The plug is the only difference

 

[fsfs]

I was only seeing ~8.5 amps max on a 110V with the Stark-supplied US charging cable (swapped out the 14-30 since I don't have that outlet at my house). Also, the charging setting on the phone amp max'd at 10 amps. Maybe I'm missing something? Based on the charging rate, I estimated 4 - 5 hours to fully charge from 0%.

The max 10 amps on the phone is battery current, not AC current going into the charger. Below 330V (battery) the charger can deliver 10A. Above 330V the current will be less than 10A because 3.3kW is the limit. The max current on the app was just a quick way to not overload the generator. Does the app only allow current limit or is there also a power limit?

As for the 8.5A, I think the charger should be able to draw more than that. Is the AC voltage drooping below 110V?

If the charger is drawing only 8.5A on 110V that will be less than 1kW to the battery and it should take about 6 hours to charge from empty. Is that what you are seeing?

 

[dpwracing]

The max 10 amps on the phone is battery current, not AC current going into the charger. Below 330V (battery) the charger can deliver 10A. Above 330V the current will be less than 10A because 3.3kW is the limit. The max current on the app was just a quick way to not overload the generator. Does the app only allow current limit or is there also a power limit?

As for the 8.5A, I think the charger should be able to draw more than that. Is the AC voltage drooping below 110V?

If the charger is drawing only 8.5A on 110V that will be less than 1kW to the battery and it should take about 6 hours to charge from empty. Is that what you are seeing?

I was seeing 1% every 3 - 4 minutes so yeah, looks like 5 - 6 hours to fully charge.

I also noticed the Amps coming down slightly as the charge built up. Started ~50% at 8.5, and as down to 8.2 at 74% per pic below. The app only allows current to be changed, I had set it at the max of 10amps.

I don't believe I have any vdroop. Don't have a way to test, but I tried a couple of separate outlets, same result.

Only other thing is I'm on an extension cord (tried both 12 and 14 gauge, no difference to charging behavior).

 

[fsfs]

I was seeing 1% every 3 - 4 minutes so yeah, looks like 5 - 6 hours to fully charge.

I also noticed the Amps coming down slightly as the charge built up. Started ~50% at 8.5, and as down to 8.2 at 74% per pic below. The app only allows current to be changed, I had set it at the max of 10amps.

I don't believe I have any vdroop. Don't have a way to test, but I tried a couple of separate outlets, same result.

Only other thing is I'm on an extension cord (tried both 12 and 14 gauge, no difference to charging behavior).

View attachment 10571

View attachment 10572

Ohhhh, now I see from the photos. That 8.2A cannot possibly be measured AC current. The charger does not send AC line voltage or current to CAN bus. Therefore, the bike/phone has no way of knowing if the charger is plugged into 110V or 220V or even what the AC current is.

The 8.5A to 8.2A is simply the theoretical maximum battery current the charger can provide given the battery voltage. The AC plug icon next to the number makes it confusing.

If you want to know the actual AC current you need to actually measure it with a meter.

 

[rayivers]

I really like the Kil-A-Watt AC meter - this 4400 looks a little easier to use than my EZ model. It completely eliminates AC-power guesswork.

 

[EDR1]

I really like the Kil-A-Watt AC meter - this 4400 looks a little easier to use than my EZ model. It completely eliminates AC-power guesswork.

 

[EDR1]

But can it survive 240vac in spite of its rated max 120 volts spec?

 

[rayivers]

But can it survive 240vac in spite of its rated max 120 volts spec?

No - this is a 120VAC unit, as I was unable to find a 240VAC one with enough power capability or the proper adaptors to be usable with the Stark. I figured I'd post it anyway as it will work for the majority of US Varg owners.

 

[EDR1]

This exact unit works great at 240vac: SURAIELEC Watt Meter, Plug-in... Amazon.com