Question about Stark charger 240v adapter: is neutral required?


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AL_V

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I understand the Stark charger is the same as the Alta charger (please correct me if that is not the case).
A nema 6-50 receptacle used for a 240v welder has no neutral, only L1, L2, and ground.
So, I can make an adapter 6-50p to L14-30r, which will have no neutral.
Will this work with the Stark charger, or does it need a neutral?
THANKS!
 
rayivers

rayivers

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Stark makes two chargers: one for the EU etc., and another for Australia (220V 50Hz, no neutral). I can't see either one requiring a neutral connection for 220-240V operation.
 
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fsfs

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rayivers said:
Stark makes two chargers: one for the EU etc., and another for Australia (220V 50Hz, no neutral). I can't see either one requiring a neutral connection for 220-240V operation.
Click to expand...
There is only one charger.

For 3.3kW the charger wants 220 - 240V range. It does not care if you are in Europe and have 230V with respect to neutral and earth or in the USA and have 240V center tapped. All it wants is 220 - 230VAC. Remember, in Europe there is no hot and neutral. When you push the plug into the socket it is random as to which side is hot and neutral.
 
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AL_V

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fsfs said:
There is only one charger.

For 3.3kW the charger wants 220 - 240V range. It does not care if you are in Europe and have 230V with respect to neutral and earth or in the USA and have 240V center tapped. All it wants is 220 - 230VAC. Remember, in Europe there is no hot and neutral. When you push the plug into the socket it is random as to which side is hot and neutral.
Click to expand...
Thank you sir, so the answer to my original question is that the charger will work in the US with L1, L2, and ground, and no neutral, correct?
And is it possible for the Stark charger to function on 120V (20amps), even knowing it will be very slow?
 
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fsfs

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AL_V said:
Thank you sir, so the answer to my original question is that the charger will work in the US with L1, L2, and ground, and no neutral, correct?
And is it possible for the Stark charger to function on 120V (20amps), even knowing it will be very slow?
Click to expand...
First question, yes. Correct.
Second question. It will work on 110V and draw about 15A, so power draw just above 1.6kW.
 
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AL_V

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fsfs said:
There is only one charger.

For 3.3kW the charger wants 220 - 240V range. It does not care if you are in Europe and have 230V with respect to neutral and earth or in the USA and have 240V center tapped. All it wants is 220 - 230VAC. Remember, in Europe there is no hot and neutral. When you push the plug into the socket it is random as to which side is hot and neutral.
Click to expand...
@fsfs, Stark shows 3 different chargers with different part numbers.
Perhaps the actual plug is the only difference?
Stark charger.jpg
 
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dpwracing

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fsfs said:
First question, yes. Correct.
Second question. It will work on 110V and draw about 15A, so power draw just above 1.6kW.
Click to expand...
I was only seeing ~8.5 amps max on a 110V with the Stark-supplied US charging cable (swapped out the 14-30 since I don't have that outlet at my house). Also, the charging setting on the phone amp max'd at 10 amps. Maybe I'm missing something? Based on the charging rate, I estimated 4 - 5 hours to fully charge from 0%.
 
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fsfs

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dpwracing said:
I was only seeing ~8.5 amps max on a 110V with the Stark-supplied US charging cable (swapped out the 14-30 since I don't have that outlet at my house). Also, the charging setting on the phone amp max'd at 10 amps. Maybe I'm missing something? Based on the charging rate, I estimated 4 - 5 hours to fully charge from 0%.
Click to expand...

The max 10 amps on the phone is battery current, not AC current going into the charger. Below 330V (battery) the charger can deliver 10A. Above 330V the current will be less than 10A because 3.3kW is the limit. The max current on the app was just a quick way to not overload the generator. Does the app only allow current limit or is there also a power limit?

As for the 8.5A, I think the charger should be able to draw more than that. Is the AC voltage drooping below 110V?

If the charger is drawing only 8.5A on 110V that will be less than 1kW to the battery and it should take about 6 hours to charge from empty. Is that what you are seeing?
 
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dpwracing

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fsfs said:
The max 10 amps on the phone is battery current, not AC current going into the charger. Below 330V (battery) the charger can deliver 10A. Above 330V the current will be less than 10A because 3.3kW is the limit. The max current on the app was just a quick way to not overload the generator. Does the app only allow current limit or is there also a power limit?

As for the 8.5A, I think the charger should be able to draw more than that. Is the AC voltage drooping below 110V?

If the charger is drawing only 8.5A on 110V that will be less than 1kW to the battery and it should take about 6 hours to charge from empty. Is that what you are seeing?
Click to expand...
I was seeing 1% every 3 - 4 minutes so yeah, looks like 5 - 6 hours to fully charge.

I also noticed the Amps coming down slightly as the charge built up. Started ~50% at 8.5, and as down to 8.2 at 74% per pic below. The app only allows current to be changed, I had set it at the max of 10amps.

I don't believe I have any vdroop. Don't have a way to test, but I tried a couple of separate outlets, same result.

Only other thing is I'm on an extension cord (tried both 12 and 14 gauge, no difference to charging behavior).

20231017_194102.jpg

20231017_194106.jpg
 
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fsfs

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dpwracing said:
I was seeing 1% every 3 - 4 minutes so yeah, looks like 5 - 6 hours to fully charge.

I also noticed the Amps coming down slightly as the charge built up. Started ~50% at 8.5, and as down to 8.2 at 74% per pic below. The app only allows current to be changed, I had set it at the max of 10amps.

I don't believe I have any vdroop. Don't have a way to test, but I tried a couple of separate outlets, same result.

Only other thing is I'm on an extension cord (tried both 12 and 14 gauge, no difference to charging behavior).

View attachment 10571

View attachment 10572
Click to expand...

Ohhhh, now I see from the photos. That 8.2A cannot possibly be measured AC current. The charger does not send AC line voltage or current to CAN bus. Therefore, the bike/phone has no way of knowing if the charger is plugged into 110V or 220V or even what the AC current is.

The 8.5A to 8.2A is simply the theoretical maximum battery current the charger can provide given the battery voltage. The AC plug icon next to the number makes it confusing.

If you want to know the actual AC current you need to actually measure it with a meter.
 
rayivers

rayivers

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EDR1 said:
But can it survive 240vac in spite of its rated max 120 volts spec?
Click to expand...

No - this is a 120VAC unit, as I was unable to find a 240VAC one with enough power capability or the proper adaptors to be usable with the Stark. I figured I'd post it anyway as it will work for the majority of US Varg owners.
 
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