Warnings on dashboard on new MXR

[Silent But Dirty]

Are you saying Alta will sell the same software they use or a redacted version?

As far as software goes, I'm not sure what you get with the laptop.

 

[Mark911]

I'll call my local dealer tomorrow. Thanks for the heads up. If true (at a reasonable cost) I'll need to apologize to Alta.

 

[OneLapper]

I’d like to have the software as well. Having to bring the bike to the dealer which is 2 hours away is an all day affair. My time is worth the cost of system.

 

[rayivers]

If you want to buy the Alta laptop and interface, all it takes is a trip to your dealer.

Wow, really? With Zero you had to a) live in a right-to-repair state and b) practically take them to court, or so I've been told.

 

[Gertech]

I'm sure in time we (consumers) will have the ability to plug these things in and do more of our own diagnostics, this is just the infancy stage of it. I have always worked on/fixed/modified my own bikes, so taking it to the dealer is so foreign to me. But I'm sure they'll get it figured out and all will be good. I'm gonna miss my silent evening rides for a week or two though!

 

[Mark911]

Well, talked to my dealer and he said the laptop systems provided by Alta to the dealers is on a "loan" basis. They don't own them and pay a deposit just in case something happens to them. As far as he knows they are NOT available to the public at any price. That's what I suspected.

Knowing how simple and cheap it would be for Alta to do it's simply unbelievable to me they haven't done so by now.

 

[rayivers]

Knowing how simple and cheap it would be for Alta to do it's simply unbelievable to me they haven't done so by now.

With Zero, the stated reason was that they didn't want their proprietary technology - especially the MBB (Main Bike Board) which integrates the controller / charger / BMS / dash unit - out in the open, for fear of a flood of Chinese Zeros appearing soon after (which hasn't happened yet). I believe this may have been a condition of their funding & military contracts as well.

 

[Mark911]

Frankly, that's not going to stop anyone anyway. If someone seriously wanted to reverse engineer something they'd just buy a whole bike and dissect it. There are several automotive type ECUs where the factories (Farrari is an example) add so many layers of security it makes breaking in through the front door difficult. This simply means one needs to "delid" the ECU and gain access to code through direct probing of the various chip memories. Figuring out the boards architecture to steal the design is much much harder and usually results in physical destruction of the board. What typical "enthusiast" is going to do that? In other words, if someone seriously wants to reverse engineer something it's only a matter of time and money. The only reason Zero probably hasn't been copied is that there's no financial upside to make it worth doing. They simply aren't that popular. Now, multiply unit sales by a million or so and it's a different story. Bottom line, money attracts money and the ability (or lack of) to READ component level performance related data already sensed and captured inside our controllers isn't going to change the natural trajectory of anything except better owner satisfaction.

 

[rayivers]

Frankly, that's not going to stop anyone anyway

+1. I've been trying to squeeze just a basic non-electronics service manual out of them for four years now, you'd think I was asking for schematics & board layouts.

 

[Philip]

All the crypto in the world can't deter a determined hacker as we hear about almost every day.

I am putting a 0.01 BTC bounty to whoever hacks the Alta and lets us log things!

 

[Fod]

Well, talked to my dealer and he said the laptop systems provided by Alta to the dealers is on a "loan" basis. They don't own them and pay a deposit just in case something happens to them. As far as he knows they are NOT available to the public at any price. That's what I suspected.

Knowing how simple and cheap it would be for Alta to do it's simply unbelievable to me they haven't done so by now.

So what your saying is it costs the amount of their deposit!

 

[Silent But Dirty]

Well, talked to my dealer and he said the laptop systems provided by Alta to the dealers is on a "loan" basis. They don't own them and pay a deposit just in case something happens to them. As far as he knows they are NOT available to the public at any price. That's what I suspected.

Knowing how simple and cheap it would be for Alta to do it's simply unbelievable to me they haven't done so by now.

That's odd, because I asked Alta directly and they told me I could order it through my dealer.

The price the dealer quoted me was to rich for my blood.

 

[Mark911]

That's odd, because I asked Alta directly and they told me I could order it through my dealer.
The price the dealer quoted me was to rich for my blood.

Maybe things are different in Canada and it shouldn't be cost prohibitive in any case. In fact, it should be offered for free upon purchase. All that's needed is the software on a cheap USB memory stick worth $5.

Again, back to the confusion issue. If I want to check on part or accessory availability for my big 6 bikes I just go to one of a dozens sites and look it up. Alta has a small page mostly with SWAG but no parts index (if available, they can add the diagnostic software there). The bill of materials can't be very large at this point. Even a simple PDM/MRP system will kick out parts lists and all that's needed is individual MSRP for each part or accessory. The dealers must have them by now so why not publish them on the Alta website? We'd also be able to see if our local sources are applying prices appropriately as well. This is all business 101.

 

[Gertech]

Dropped the bike off with Steve and the service team at HVMC this evening. Depending on the work load, they may be able to plug it in and get started on it tomorrow.

Mark's right on with the whole reverse-engineering of the bikes. If there's money to be made, it'll happen. We use a diagnostic tool from a company called AutoLogic on the BMWs in the shop I work for. They're completely independent of BMW and reverse engineer the entire electrical system on the cars to build their software. In most cases (at least on the slightly older cars) the AutoLogic tool works better than the factory BMW software. Just proves the point that if there are enough of these bikes out there and money can be made, people will build software packages to diagnose them. And I can say with confidence that the electrical diagnostic system on the Alta is much less complex than a modern BMW.

 

[aremean79]

Dropped the bike off with Steve and the service team at HVMC this evening. Depending on the work load, they may be able to plug it in and get started on it tomorrow.

Mark's right on with the whole reverse-engineering of the bikes. If there's money to be made, it'll happen. We use a diagnostic tool from a company called AutoLogic on the BMWs in the shop I work for. They're completely independent of BMW and reverse engineer the entire electrical system on the cars to build their software. In most cases (at least on the slightly older cars) the AutoLogic tool works better than the factory BMW software. Just proves the point that if there are enough of these bikes out there and money can be made, people will build software packages to diagnose them. And I can say with confidence that the electrical diagnostic system on the Alta is much less complex than a modern BMW.

Do keep us updated @Gertech

 

[bsatt69]

Just got the "Stopped: 103" when trying to charge my MXR for the 2nd time, only have 2 hours on bike. I have the new 240v fast charger. Called tech support and there is a new update that should solve this problem. So back to the dealer...

 

[aremean79]

Just got the "Stopped: 103" when trying to charge my MXR for the 2nd time, only have 2 hours on bike. I have the new 240v fast charger. Called tech support and there is a new update that should solve this problem. So back to the dealer...

This is starting to be a bit worrying for me.
Do let us know of the outcome.

 

[snydes]

Just got the "Stopped: 103" when trying to charge my MXR for the 2nd time, only have 2 hours on bike. I have the new 240v fast charger. Called tech support and there is a new update that should solve this problem. So back to the dealer...

Just out of curiosity what are the last three numbers of your serial number if you don’t mind me asking?

 

[Gertech]

My bike is #327. Got word from Steve at HVMC today that they'll be replacing the battery and ignition switch on my bike. He said they ordered the parts but it'll be 4-7 business days before they arrive (California to New York).

 

[bsatt69]

Just out of curiosity what are the last three numbers of your serial number if you don’t mind me asking?

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