Kayo eC2

[bayodome]

Looks like Kayo is throwing it's electric hat in the ring at EICMA. Doesn't look like the most sophisticated motor (air cooled), battery or controller, but happy to see another company with a semi-serious full-size offering. Supermoto version too.

 

[Lost]

I wouldn't expect much... been out a year ish, and I believe 2600€

Kove also brought an eMX.

...and there were pictures of a temu Varg as well.

 

[OpaTsupa]

I wouldn't expect much... been out a year ish, and I believe 2600€

Kove also brought an eMX.

...and there were pictures of a temu Varg as well.

I would say the same for the Hero eBike.
They gave absolutely no information about it.



It's amazing how many new E and gas off-road bikes were shown at EICMA, but you can not buy or even read about 90% of them.

 

[bayodome]

I would say the same for the Hero eBike.
They gave absolutely no information about it.

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It's amazing how many new E and gas off-road bikes were shown at EICMA, but you can not buy or even read about 90% of them.

Yup, just, "Here it is. Feel free to speculate on specs or timeline, cuz we ain't telling you shit!" Never understood this strategy. You know what worked? Stark providing intimate detail from Day 1. Built the expectation and met it in reality/production.

 

[Lost]

It's amazing how many new E and gas off-road bikes were shown at EICMA, but you can not buy or even read about 90% of them.

EICMA is a trade show, so alot of what you'll see are concepts/preproduction. Most of these smaller companies are looking for partnership in one way or another, be it importing, manufacturing etc. The bikes are there to get investors in the door.

 

[Karinshi]

That VIDA model seems like a 7/8 in size, like the DUST... interesting bike, hopefully they find investors and the electric world grows

 

[DonCox]

Build your own on your favorite bike/frame. I like the 2014-2022 KTM 250SXF, I have built new and older Honda CRF's, Yamaha YZ250F and 450F 2014 and newer. I am 80 years old and here is mine at The World Vet Nationals, with me on it. I can give you a list of the parts and power, if you want them. Or on this forum:

2019 KTM 450SXF Factory Edition Conversion to Electric Street Legal

I just finished this build and I wanted to share the build, because I think this is one of the easiest frame/models to convert, with minimum modification. None to the frame , only plastics are modified. This is a 2019 KTM, but I believe the GasGas and Husky will be almost identical...

electricdirtriders.com

I was racing this at 72V nominal 300A

48K views · 525 reactions | Check this thing out! Don't Cox builds home-made E-Bikes with this one roughly getting around 45 HP. | Motocross Action

Check this thing out! Don't Cox builds home-made E-Bikes with this one roughly getting around 45 HP.

www.facebook.com

 

[VINSANITY]

The more I look at the current market offerings I have come to my own conclusion no one is building what I want, so I built my own using the Don Cox formula.

On a positive note it is awesome we have all these new options, Sur Ron started a whole category, reasonable cost, ever increasing power, quick swap batteries are all great. Now there are some really good 3/4 or 7/8 size bikes, also good.

But the only full size offering is the Stark. It’s successful and it’s a nice bike but I think it misses the mark, it’s heavy and you can’t quick swap the battery. Also the amount of power is impressive but is it usable?

I think the market needs a full size offering with traditional geometry, with a frame design that’s bullet proof (pick any modern chassis). Make it possible to quick swap batteries, and have short range (low weight) batteries and long range (higher weight) batteries where the rider can choose what option they need. Power 40-50 KW.

Sell it for $6,500 to $7,000 - keep costs down by using Japanese brand wheels, suspension etc - just use what works and what is readily available. Relatively small changes to the existing Japanese frames could make all this work.

Yamaha should just hire Don and then do what he says, it’s crazy Don is friends with Kenny Roberts, maybe Kenny can twist Yamaha’s arm to just do it.

 

[Border Dave]

But the only full size offering is the Stark.

Do you not consider the Arctic Leopard EXE 880 a full size bike?

 

[Lost]

The more I look at the current market offerings I have come to my own conclusion no one is building what I want, so I built my own using the Don Cox formula.

On a positive note it is awesome we have all these new options, Sur Ron started a whole category, reasonable cost, ever increasing power, quick swap batteries are all great. Now there are some really good 3/4 or 7/8 size bikes, also good.

But the only full size offering is the Stark. It’s successful and it’s a nice bike but I think it misses the mark, it’s heavy and you can’t quick swap the battery. Also the amount of power is impressive but is it usable?

I think the market needs a full size offering with traditional geometry, with a frame design that’s bullet proof (pick any modern chassis). Make it possible to quick swap batteries, and have short range (low weight) batteries and long range (higher weight) batteries where the rider can choose what option they need. Power 40-50 KW.

Sell it for $6,500 to $7,000 - keep costs down by using Japanese brand wheels, suspension etc - just use what works and what is readily available. Relatively small changes to the existing Japanese frames could make all this work.

Yamaha should just hire Don and then do what he says, it’s crazy Don is friends with Kenny Roberts, maybe Kenny can twist Yamaha’s arm to just do it.

The only real reason Stark is currently successful is the headline act... 80hp. If it had come out with say 50hp, people would have said "good fit and finish" then carried on with their lives and another start up would be struggling.

It's not going to be possible for the the big players to sell emotos at 6-7k. You'll be looking at 9-10k, they don't have the production lines. The set up cost is passed on to consumers.
That said look at Yamaha's partnership with Electric Motion, a cheaper option than going it alone. Unlike most other manufacturers though, Yamaha already does something similar, as most of its engines actually come from Minarelli.
Can't imagine Honda letting that one fly...

 

[Theo]

Props to those who build their own e-dirtbikes and thank you for sharing your work, since it's important that people know that it's possible and it's also interesting to read about those conversions.
However, converting an ICE has its pros and cons and I wouldn't say that it's something advisable to everybody.

Stark has explained, in one of their videos (IIRC it was the one of the first, the 16 minutes one) that the motor is overpowered because it's more efficient to partially use the power of a too powerful motor than to use all the power of one that has just the right amount.

 

[bayodome]

Do you not consider the Arctic Leopard EXE 880 a full size bike?

If you rode that bike, you'd understand why it's not even a part of the conversation.

 

[Border Dave]

If you rode that bike, you'd understand why it's not even a part of the conversation.

I was looking at it before I bought my Varg. It has good numbers on paper and had some good reviews on YouTube. If a rider is only doing casual trail riding, is it not a good candidate?

 

[VINSANITY]

I built my first ebike (bicycle) in 2013, it was cool for the time, a custom frame made but a guy in El Segundo (called a phasor). It had the most powerful hub motor you could buy at the time and a 90 volt battery. At that time you really couldn’t build or buy a full size e-dirt bike (maybe zero) so things have come a long way.

At the pace things keep improving it will be interesting to see how much better the offerings will be in 5 years.

There is a market for the right bike(s) offered at the right price.

 

[bayodome]

I built my first ebike (bicycle) in 2013, it was cool for the time, a custom frame made but a guy in El Segundo (called a phasor). It had the most powerful hub motor you could buy at the time and a 90 volt battery. At that time you really couldn’t build or buy a full size e-dirt bike (maybe zero) so things have come a long way.

At the pace things keep improving it will be interesting to see how much better the offerings will be in 5 years.

There is a market for the right bike(s) offered at the right price.

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Nice. Ahead of the curve! Yeah I think a lot of us here have either built or attempted to build our own ebikes/motos.

I completed my build YZ250F conversion in 2023 with a lot of help from Don Cox, who is kinda the guru around here. My YZ-E can certainly still hold it's own, on the track or trail, but the potential for the technology seems currently limitless.

But not everyone wants to or can build their own machine. And to be honest, if an option for a full-size electric MX bike had existed when I first began my building journey...well, that journey probably never would've happened. I think the first Stark was delivered like a week or two before I completed my build, so at that point they still seemed like a concept more than a reality.

The more companies offering emotos, the more people will ride or get on board, in my opinion. Just like the Light Bee and Ultra Bee opened up entirely new markets and ways of riding, full-size emotos are doing the same. I just hope the momentum continues. Fortunately there are so many new companies coming along with new and exciting options (just was reading about the full-size RFN Warrior Race that's in development [81hp, 108kg, quick swap battery]) so we don't need to rely on the established ICE Japanese or Euro manufacturers anymore.

 

[Theo]

But not everyone wants to or can build their own machine.

Exactly. For me, it can surely be an interesting project that, if I prioritized it more, could have the money and time to be accomplished mostly for the satisfaction and the learning involved.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure it would work in practice. At least here in Europe, it would be very hard to get it homologated for road use and at least in Italy I suspect they wouldn't allow you in most MX tracks with it.
I?ve never seen one in real life.
I also question how safe and waterproof it can be especially if it's not the Electro & Co YZ conversion but rather something unique created by me.
I want my dirt riding to be as happy as possible and being worried for a machine built with my too little knowledge and skills may generate more trouble and anxiety than fun.

Fortunately there are so many new companies coming along with new and exciting options (just was reading about the full-size RFN Warrior Race that's in development [81hp, 108kg, quick swap battery]) so we don't need to rely on the established ICE Japanese or Euro manufacturers anymore.

Especially since theose established manufacturers seem to be little interested in E-dirtbikes.