Sur Ron Ultra Bee

[CampDirectorG]

Can't wait to hear back.

Congrats! Let us know how it goes. I'm looking at the storm probably for me and maybe the ultra for my brother who is smaller than me physically. I'm about 5'11 and 185 and he's maybe 5'6 and 165 (I'm guessing).

 

[F451]

Another great video by Tucker, he is LOVING the new 21/18" wheels and tires.

He just killed my plan to NOT buy a 21/18" wheel set and just upgrade the 19" tires and be happy with it. I knew this was going to happen, Lol.

Pretty decent price too, I think I may be ordering these wheels. Bigger sprocket, HD tubes too.

Tucker is running Bridgestone M59 80/100-21 front, Dunlop MX33 90/100-18 rear.

Anyone have any good suggestions for good wet/roots/rocks tires, that are not too heavy, that might work in the PacNW?

 

[Number Six]

IRC IX09w 'gekkota' 110/100
Those are the lightest of the gummy rear tires as they are 2 ply, not 3.
They are an open pattern which sheds mud well & the compound is as soft or softer than a trials tire.
There is also a matching gekkota front 80/100 that's equally grippy.

 

[F451]

IRC IX09w 'gekkota' 110/100
Those are the lightest of the gummy rear tires as they are 2 ply, not 3.
They are an open pattern which sheds mud well & the compound is as soft or softer than a trials tire.
There is also a matching gekkota front 80/100 that's equally grippy.

Thanks, I think I may order up a set of these and see how they do.

Edit: just put in my order for the 21/18" wheelset from ECR, ordered HD tubes and the IRC IX09w Gekkota's. I like that they are light and gummy. They get mixed reviews, some complaining knobs getting ripped off, short life, but I think that's probably bigger bikes, 450's, 500's? I think they will work fine for this sub 200 lb bike, we will see. Thanks again for the recommendation.

 

[Number Six]

Yeah, they are kinda specialty tires, but the grip is terrific, even on rocks.
Experiment a bit with pressures as they are sensitive to that given the very soft sidewalls & crown, there's a 'sweet spot' where they perform well without feeling too vague.
Once you get them aired up just right - it's like having additional suspension.

 

[mr.skywalker]

Most people that are looking at ix09s are doing hard enduro and running mouse's as the sidewalls can tear as well. Could probably be OK with a tube but for sure they dont work well with Tubliss. The go to tire thats basically same tread with a little more reinforcement and harder compound(basically just a more reliable tire) is their newer, JX8 gekkota. All these are specialized tires though and not meant to be roosted with or ride much over 15mph as they are about getting thru nasty low traction riding.

If on a budget, wanting good life but still wanting a gummy, the Tusk Recon is good and if you want a little more grip but still lower cost the shinko 525 and 505 cheaters are good options too. Kenda has a hybrid as well and its supposedly the best for everything(traction and knob life) and cost is reasonable( I think this is charged cycle works recommended 16." Ive done alot of research for my surron and all these are offered in 16" sizes.

 

[Oded]

Got a chance to test ride the Ultra Bee. It is a fun bike, and will suit so many riders.

Bike was stock. Power delivery is very smooth and predictable with good low speed handling.
Brakes bite well. Can not say anything about the suspension as it was a gravel road test ride.
I was a bit disappointed with the power. It's OK, but nowhere near Alta territory. Alta pulls hard at 20 km/h and upwards, Ultra Bee doesn't. That said, it's still nimble enough.

Riding position is not suited for tall guys like me. Handlecbar needs some riser and twisting it forward. Pegs lowered a bit. I guess it's all possible, but it's not as roomy as my Alta.

Rear wheel is the first thing that needs replacement to a proper chubby size.

A real fun bike!

 

[Number Six]

Thanks, I think I may order up a set of these and see how they do.

Edit: just put in my order for the 21/18" wheelset from ECR, ordered HD tubes and the IRC IX09w Gekkota's. I like that they are light and gummy. They get mixed reviews, some complaining knobs getting ripped off, short life, but I think that's probably bigger bikes, 450's, 500's? I think they will work fine for this sub 200 lb bike, we will see. Thanks again for the recommendation.

You're gonna be glad you bought the full size wheels & gummy tires - as with many of the small e-bikes, there is a struggle to get underway if any momentum is lost going up hill.
Hard-ish enduro Aussie style ;

 

[enjoythesilenc]

I'm pretty sure at least one of us has taken delivery, inquiring minds want to know the skinny

 

[F451]

I rec'd my Ultra Bee a couple of weeks ago, some observations of the bike in stock trim, factory default settings (keep in mind, and in fairness to the bike, I'm 6'5", 210 lbs, so even most full sized bikes feel small to me):

I've been a bit underwhelmed by it during my few very short test rides. It seems to be seriously lacking in the power/snap department, but I haven't had a chance to take it out on my favorite single track, so am reserving judgement until I get to do that.
It feels tiny to me, like TTR125 or KLX140 sized. I had heard it was 7/8th sized, but I didn't realize how small it would feel.
It is, and feels extremely light, which is awesome.
The stock tires are crap, the 19" front wheels/tires, and the low handlebar setup feels very odd, I did not feel confident with the handling in the short sections of single track that I took it on.
Overall quality is pretty good, was packaged very securely, bike arrived safe and sound in its shipping crate.
The MSO document was not included with the bike, and Charged Cycle Works who I ordered it from did not tell me this, so I was a bit concerned when I could not find the document. I emailed them and they replied explained it was coming "soon". It showed up about 2 weeks after the bike, the document looks/feels like a copy of the official document, in other words not very official feeling. It is in English. I hope my local licensing office will accept it when I go to title the bike so I can get an orv sticker (and possibly plate the bike if it grows on me).
The bike has a 17 digit vin number stamped on the headstock, and shown on the MSO document.
The footpegs are large cast items and the hinge/attachment design is not a standard dirt bike size, so finding replacement pegs, or more ideally for me, lowered pegs, will be a challenge. I was hoping the hinge/attachment design would be similar to one of the major OEM's like Honda, Yamaha, KTM, etc.

I installed the aftermarket KKE 21/18" wheel set with a IRC IX-09 Gekkota Gummy 80/100x21 front tire, and a IRC IX-09 Gekkota Gummy 110/100x18 rear tire, and adjusted the throttle sensitivity setting to max sensitivity (quickest throttle response), and the bike felt much more responsive, and handled way better. With the new wheel/tires setup it handled like a normal dirt bike, a very light, small dirt bike. It also had quite a bit more snap, although it still felt lacking in power, especially above 10 mph or so.

I bought it thinking it would hold me over until the Stark Varg arrived, and I could sell my Alta. I was also thinking my daughter/friends could ride it.

But now with the news that the Varg is 260 lbs, I'm not sure I will be purchasing it as I don't really need or want another 260+ lb e-dirt bike, I already have one of those, was really excited about a 240 lb Alta killer, but that's not happening. So not sure what I'm going to do.

Hopefully, with some additional tweaks (larger rear sprocket, non-o-ring chain, power/regen settings tweaks?, tall seat, bar risers, lower pegs) the Ultra Bee will be fun enough to keep around and I'll sell the Alta, decide on the Varg later. Meanwhile I'll be waiting to see if any of the other major OEM's release a 240 lb e-dirt bike (I don't see anything on the horizon).

I'm hoping to get up to my club property soon to do a more comprehensive test ride on familiar trails and see what the bike can do, and I'll report back. But so far, I'm not sure this bike is a keeper.

 

[B. FRANK]

so far Sur Rons are toys and should be looked at that way. unless you are 5,4 120 lbs you will never hammer trails like you can on an actual dirt bike. having said that they can be really fun toys and you can take them places Altas and vargs cannot go legally. I am sure that the aftermarket will provide you with numerous choices for upgrades and for a hell of a lot of money you can build a pretty cool toy, but it will still be a toy. remember that it only weighs as much as a real dirt bikes frame. it won't take the abuse that an alta or varg will...ever. it is good for letting others ride an electric bike before letting some squid trash your real bike. enjoy it for what it is or sell it. ps I am 64 y.o. 6'3 and 270 lbs. I feel your pain bro!

 

[Number Six]

Good synopsis - thanks.
I was interested in one of those when announced, but in the initial test Tucker did on it he stated it was smaller than a Freeride-E & that decided it for me as I owned one of the 2 stroke Freerides ( same chassis ) & found the short wheelbase & steep steering angle too sketchy for my kind of terrain. On the right type of trail it was a scalpel but overall it lacked the sure-footedness of a full size bike over any kind of rough terrain.

With all that I've been hearing & told about an Alta & now the Varg feeling like a 125 once in motion, I'm curious about your comment about the 260 lb weight of both bikes.
If a 260 lb full size E-bike does in fact feel like a small bore 125 once moving - how does that weight make itself known ?, in which single track scenarios does the weight make itself most evident in-the-negative when riding ? Descents, tight corners, tricky off cambers, loose rocks .. all of it ?
Or do those 'feels like a 125' statements only apply to MX or faster hare scrambles courses where it's easier to keep up some momentum ?
.

 

[mr.skywalker]

With all that I've been hearing & told about an Alta & now the Varg feeling like a 125 once in motion, I'm curious about your comment about the 260 lb weight of both bikes.
If a 260 lb full size E-bike does in fact feel like a small bore 125 once moving - how does that weight make itself known ?, in which single track scenarios does the weight make itself most evident in-the-negative when riding ? Descents, tight corners, tricky off cambers, loose rocks .. all of it ?
Or do those 'feels like a 125' statements only apply to MX or faster hare scrambles courses where it's easier to keep up some momentum ?
.

Ive not ridden a Alta but Ive ridden bikes that tried odd engineering to create similar feel. The one in particular Ive owned for a while was the 2010 Husaberg FE450 that had the engine rotated 70 degrees so the mass of the rotating assembly acted in a different direction than the typical up and down of most bikes. This meant the engine speed didnt make the bike want to stand up or stay in position, it actually wanted to "fall over" more so it felt nimble yet the bike was actually heavy, I think close to 270lbs. I say all that to set the precedent its a similar to why electrics "feel" lighter. The berg honestly felt lighter than a 250f at speeds above 2-3rd gear but in slow speeds under 5mph it showed its weight enough to the point I had to get rid of it since I ride tight trails and Im 5'8 130lbs(120lbs when I owned it) so its top heavy feel was an issue every ride. Maybe that makes a little sense?

 

[F451]

Good synopsis - thanks.
I was interested in one of those when announced, but in the initial test Tucker did on it he stated it was smaller than a Freeride-E & that decided it for me as I owned one of the 2 stroke Freerides ( same chassis ) & found the short wheelbase & steep steering angle too sketchy for my kind of terrain. On the right type of trail it was a scalpel but overall it lacked the sure-footedness of a full size bike over any kind of rough terrain.

With all that I've been hearing & told about an Alta & now the Varg feeling like a 125 once in motion, I'm curious about your comment about the 260 lb weight of both bikes.
If a 260 lb full size E-bike does in fact feel like a small bore 125 once moving - how does that weight make itself known ?, in which single track scenarios does the weight make itself most evident in-the-negative when riding ? Descents, tight corners, tricky off cambers, loose rocks .. all of it ?
Or do those 'feels like a 125' statements only apply to MX or faster hare scrambles courses where it's easier to keep up some momentum ?
.

The weight makes it self known in the tighter gnarly terrain when braking, especially when trying to brake extremely quickly, then turning. Even though the bike feels light once you get moving, you are still trying to slow down and turn 260+ lbs of bike, especially when turning it in extremely tight situations.

"Descents, tight corners, tricky off cambers, loose rocks .. all of it ?"

Yes.

Also, trying to loft the front end, the Alta has plenty of power, but it feels front end heavy to me, and at times I have to really yank the bars to get the front end up.

And of course if you have to lift the bike over any trail obstacles, pick it up, etc. Sidehills, gnarly switchbacks, etc, just take a bit more energy and care then a lighter bike.

And less importantly, but it still annoys me, is simply moving the bike around in the garage, putting it on a bike stand, loading it in my truck, its a porker.

 

[Number Six]

"Descents, tight corners, tricky off cambers, loose rocks .. all of it ?"

Yes.

Conflicted once again as to this purchase, at least for my intended usage.
Maybe demo rides may present themselves at local dealers soon.

 

[TheTyLife]

Hi all, I have been a dirt rider forever (first 250 2-strokes for many years, now I have a Honda CRF450x) and I'm wondering if you think the Ultra Bee would work for me. I would say I'm an expert rider, though that is a matter of opinion, and I ride pretty fast and hard for a relatively old guy. I like the Storm Bee, but It's even heavier than my Honda, which I am not sure I will like. I think the Light Bee, at least stock will be way too small, and I'm wondering if the Ultra Bee will be the goldilocks "just right" electric bike for me. Any thoughts?

I also like that it's half the price of the KTM Freeride, and the Stark Varg (which looks amazing). I generally find mountain bikes squirly and tiny and they don't have the heft I'm used to for pounding through rocks and whoops etc. I ride mostly trail, so I'm just looking for opinions if people think the Ultra Bee would work for an old-school ICE dirt rider, or if I will need to get the Storm or the Varg. Thanks in advance for your help.

I used to ride a YZ 250 and KTM 300 XCW TPI. The trails in Hawai'i are mostly very tight and technical, muddy, roots, hill climbs etc. I was always keeping an eye out for lighter weight 2 strokes as a replacement in the past. The Ultra Bee is hitting such a sweet spot for me right now, it's lighter than my 2 strokes were (feels much lighter when riding) and I'm getting excellent range because even when you're bombing through the trails I ride, you're not going fast at all. If I rode more open/ fast trails, I would likely be a little disappointed in electric dirt bike range.

For rocks... it feels just as good as my YZ or KTM did, if anything I have to let some compression out of the forks. It doesn't have the XPLOR WP tricked out suspension or Ohlins, but the lighter weight gives it an advantage. Below is my first off-road ride where I talk a bit about the bike. Little river crossing and some rock gardens in there. I'll be hitting more gnarly stuff soon once I get my suspension better adjusted.

 

[TheTyLife]

I think you will find the Ultra Bee not suitable for your type of riding. I consider it a play bike more then a full on dirt bike. I think the Stark Varg would suit you better. As B. Frank mentioned, I think you will find the Ultra Bee not as capable as your Honda or really any typical full on dirt bike. The suspension, wheels, and probably brakes will not be up to that performance level.

I'm buying an Ultra Bee as a play bike while I wait for my Stark Varg to be delivered (Nov. 2023). If I love it, I will likely sell my Alta while I wait for my Varg. If I don't love it, but its a fun little trail bike, I may keep it and let my daughters and friends ride it. If family and friends aren't into riding it, I figure I'll have no problem selling it used and won't take too much of a hit financially.

If I'm loving the Ultra Bee and decide to keep it, I will be looking into upgrading the suspension and wheels at a minimum. The Charged Cycle Works guy posted a comment about suspension on that youtube video in response to my question about whether a 125 2 stroke set of forks might be adapted to the Ultra Bee. He commented that he thought an 85 fork set would better suit the bike (indicating to me that the bike is really a play bike for full sized adults).

Next step for mods would be upgraded controller and battery (more power and range), but I don't see myself spending that kind of coin on it when I've got a Stark Varg coming in November.

But, I'm really hoping I love the Ultra Bee just the way it is. The 200 lb wieght is right around a 125 2 stroke, should be super fun if the suspension is not terrible (it probably will be Lol).

And of course, bottom line is, if you can get a ride on one, that will let you know for sure. If I was in your shoes I'd be keeping my ears open for any New England Ultra Bee owners, wouldn't be shy about asking if you could take a short test ride on it. Most e-dirt bike guys are happy to allow test rides as long as you're not a complete and obvious knucklehead. And of course reach out to any of the Ultra Bee dealers in New England about test rides (not sure if there are any dealers in NE).

And of course keep us posted if you get a ride on one, or purchase one, always great to get feedback from long term dirt bike peeps, helps the rest of us understand the capabilities of these super fun e-dirt bikes.

I would argue if he likes rock gardens and very gnarly terrain, I'd take an ultra bee and even light bee over a stark varg. 250+ lbs is not a bike you want to be regularly taking into the gnar. I expect the ultra to be come VERY popular here in Hawaii, modded light bees are already all over the trails.

 

[F451]

I would argue if he likes rock gardens and very gnarly terrain, I'd take an ultra bee and even light bee over a stark varg. 250+ lbs is not a bike you want to be regularly taking into the gnar. I expect the ultra to be come VERY popular here in Hawaii, modded light bees are already all over the trails.

I have changed my tune and agree with you.

After buying a UB and putting on the 21/18" wheels and gummy tires, playing with the throttle sensitivity settings and suspension settings, I'm really liking it, especially for the tight single track.

My only issue is that it is not full sized, more like 7/8 sized, but I'm an outlier at 6'5", 210 lbs. For regular peeps, this bike is going to be very popular and people are going to love it. Meanwhile I'll be doing all the usual tall guy mods and hopefully getting a better fit for me and then I can really rip on it.

 

[F451]

Tucker is throwing some cash at his UB, upgraded controller and battery = $$$.

EBMX X-9000 Controller & EBMX 80.5v 73Ah battery.

30-ish miles single track range at a fast pace, he thinks 40-50 at a moderate pace on single track is possible with this setup. Good signs of things to come, looking forward to increased performance and lower cost e-dirt bikes, they are slowly happening.

 

[mr.skywalker]

Yea one of the guys who used to ride at the trails I ride at now is on an Ultra and doing hard enduro(keepupwithajones on youtube) and hes already done the X-9000 controller but for me after riding a stock Ultra demo at TKO Idk why anyone needs more for that type of riding and the throttle control seemed fine for technical.

Here is his his latest video if you want to see some hard enduro riding on one.