Varg MX 1.2

[Beagle]

price point too at nearly 30 percent dearer than a gas bike it should come
with the best of everything.

FYI that appears to be specific to the Australian market, in other countries price is much closer to European bikes.

For instance in France, 60 hp MX 1.2 is merely 40 € more expensive than 2025 KTM 450 SXF while 80 hp MX 1.2 is cheaper than 2025 450 SXF FE.

 

[Theo]

FYI that appears to be specific to the Australian market, in other countries price is much closer to European bikes.

For instance in France, 60 hp MX 1.2 is merely 40 € more expensive than 2025 KTM 450 SXF while 80 hp MX 1.2 is cheaper than 2025 450 SXF FE.

IMO the running costs of motocross bikes should always be considered when comparing how expensive two bikes are and it's difficult to do so with an electric bike because:
1-if you don't recharge at all at the track, like @Johnny Depp says he does, then the cost of electricity is only what you pay for the recharge at home, while if you do recharge the cost depends on the way in which you do it. In my case for example I use electrical outlets available in the parking lots and different tracks charge different amounts.
2-Electric motors and battery wear, too but IMO it's too early to really state how long they are really expected to last and it's especially difficult with the batteries, since manufacturers of course like to take advantage of the ongoing improvements and so by the time some cells have been used for a couple of years, the manufacturers have already switched to newer ones and who knows for sure how the new cells will compare.

 

[UKLee]

FYI that appears to be specific to the Australian market, in other countries price is much closer to European bikes.

For instance in France, 60 hp MX 1.2 is merely 40 € more expensive than 2025 KTM 450 SXF while 80 hp MX 1.2 is cheaper than 2025 450 SXF FE.

Why would you want to buy a ktm? way overpriced, in the UK £8000 for a new YZ450f stark 1.2 is £10,490

 

[Erwin P]

IMO the running costs of motocross bikes should always be considered when comparing how expensive two bikes are and it's difficult to do so with an electric bike because:
1-if you don't recharge at all at the track, like @Johnny Depp says he does, then the cost of electricity is only what you pay for the recharge at home, while if you do recharge the cost depends on the way in which you do it. In my case for example I use electrical outlets available in the parking lots and different tracks charge different amounts.
2-Electric motors and battery wear, too but IMO it's too early to really state how long they are really expected to last and it's especially difficult with the batteries, since manufacturers of course like to take advantage of the ongoing improvements and so by the time some cells have been used for a couple of years, the manufacturers have already switched to newer ones and who knows for sure how the new cells will compare.

- Even my gas generator runs at 1/5th of the cost of an ICE MX bike. But lets say everything incluided, high E prices and low gas prices it's half the cost. Let's just say €15 per day of riding...? 30x a year is €450. In 2 years €900. Low noise generator is €600 so you save €300 and have a generator now.

- There is the cost of risk. With my Stark i'm 100% sure how much the Powertrain will cost me in the first 2 years. And the 2 years after that might be €1000 since you can take the extra warranty. Wear is a non issue when you have warranty covering that.
With my ICE in 2 years i do at least 3 pistons, 1 connection rod/crankshaft bearings etc, 1 clutch and have to replace 5 airfilters. Lets also add in 6 more cans of oil tha the Stark. I do all the work myself and it ends up costing around €1800 IF (a big IF) nothing unexpected happens. I had a big engine seizure that costed me another €1800.
If i had the shop do the standard work i would end up well over €4000. That seizure would also have been in the €3000 range.

So in 2 years you have a difference of well over €2000 or even over €4000 if you let the shop do the work and nothing goes wrong. And i'm being generous on the ICE here, i expect it to be even more.
And then we're not even talking hours you put in working on it or cleaning airfilters!

So IF your battery dies the second the warranty is over you are still somewhere in range of what an ICE would have cost you. But now you are faced with just a 15 minute job instead of an entire overhaul.

 

[Theo]

- Even my gas generator runs at 1/5th of the cost of an ICE MX bike. But lets say everything incluided, high E prices and low gas prices it's half the cost. Let's just say €15 per day of riding...? 30x a year is €450. In 2 years €900. Low noise generator is €600 so you save €300 and have a generator now.

- There is the cost of risk. With my Stark i'm 100% sure how much the Powertrain will cost me in the first 2 years. And the 2 years after that might be €1000 since you can take the extra warranty. Wear is a non issue when you have warranty covering that.
With my ICE in 2 years i do at least 3 pistons, 1 connection rod/crankshaft bearings etc, 1 clutch and have to replace 5 airfilters. Lets also add in 6 more cans of oil tha the Stark. I do all the work myself and it ends up costing around €1800 IF (a big IF) nothing unexpected happens. I had a big engine seizure that costed me another €1800.
If i had the shop do the standard work i would end up well over €4000. That seizure would also have been in the €3000 range.

So in 2 years you have a difference of well over €2000 or even over €4000 if you let the shop do the work and nothing goes wrong. And i'm being generous on the ICE here, i expect it to be even more.
And then we're not even talking hours you put in working on it or cleaning airfilters!

So IF your battery dies the second the warranty is over you are still somewhere in range of what an ICE would have cost you. But now you are faced with just a 15 minute job instead of an entire overhaul.

And the truth is that, for example, the time in which you hear a weird noise from the right side of the engine and you remove the right side cranckcase cover, if the gasket breaks and sticks in part on one side and in part on the other you may need to spend like 10 € for a new one and 2 hours of your time just to locate and replace some 2 € worn washer behind the clutch basket, even though people would then describe it as a 10 minutes job whereas in ten minutes they had just drained the oil and gathered the tools.
Piston inspection on a 4 stroke? Well, even if the piston, when measured, is still useable, you have to replace the expensive, non reuseable, head gasket.
And so on, there are so many things that one could consider.
Personally I had fun doing maintenance in the first years of riding, then it became less and less interesting and rewarding and I started feeling like still being at work when doing it.
That's the main reason for which I wanted the Varg and so far I'm satisfied because with an ICE I would have surely done much more maintenance by now.

So IF your battery dies the second the warranty is over you are still somewhere in range of what an ICE would have cost you. But now you are faced with just a 15 minute job instead of an entire overhaul.

Just when you do the math remember that the battery is expected to surely lose capacity at some point and when its capacity will be below your acceptable limits, as far as I've understood, it won't be covered by the warranty if it still works.

 

[Beagle]

Why would you want to buy a ktm? way overpriced, in the UK £8000 for a new YZ450f stark 1.2 is £10,490

Just comparing the price of ICE and electric dirt bike made in Europe shows electrics are not really more expensive than ICE made on the same continent.

KTM: Varg is at the same price or precisely 40 € more (+0.3%), with 2025 KTM price
Triumph: Varg costs 800 € more (+6.7%)
Ducati: Varg is cheaper by 200 € (-1.6%)

Yes Japanese dirt bikes have always been cheaper than Euro bikes, regardless of the power train.
BTW, YZ450F price is £9600, Varg cost £900 more (9.4%).

Then see above comments about cost of ownership and 2 years warranty.

This doesn't mean electrics are better for everyone, it's all about riding what makes you grinning. But I find it disingenuous to say they're more expensive when they're actually priced really close to other Euro MX bikes and they obviously cost less in maintenance.

 

[Erwin P]

And the truth is that, for example, the time in which you hear a weird noise from the right side of the engine and you remove the right side cranckcase cover, if the gasket breaks and sticks in part on one side and in part on the other you may need to spend like 10 € for a new one and 2 hours of your time just to locate and replace some 2 € worn washer behind the clutch basket, even though people would then describe it as a 10 minutes job whereas in ten minutes they had just drained the oil and gathered the tools.
Piston inspection on a 4 stroke? Well, even if the piston, when measured, is still useable, you have to replace the expensive, non reuseable, head gasket.
And so on, there are so many things that one could consider.
Personally I had fun doing maintenance in the first years of riding, then it became less and less interesting and rewarding and I started feeling like still being at work when doing it.
That's the main reason for which I wanted the Varg and so far I'm satisfied because with an ICE I would have surely done much more maintenance by now.


Just when you do the math remember that the battery is expected to surely lose capacity at some point and when its capacity will be below your acceptable limits, as far as I've understood, it won't be covered by the warranty if it still works.

Same here, i love working on bikes. I paid for my study by overhauling Minarelli AM6 engines (6 speed 2 stroke moped engines really close to a MX engine).
HOWEVER... I like to do it when i got the time for it and if i had to do something for money (like when i was a student) it was the most ''fun'' way to do it. Now however i have a house, a Girlfriend (who, thank god, loves riding and tinkering as well) and a fulltime job that pays well enough to not have to work in my spare time.
And somehow engine problems always happen when you really need the bike to work. With Stark you might be waiting for parts, but when there it's all done within minutes, except for the powertrain wich is still well under 1 evening work.

Correct on the battery. IF after 2 years the battery would have dropped to like 5kWh (wich it didn't) i would sure want a new battery. However that leaves me with a good battery AND one spare that works for most purposes. Like going to an MX track is also fun when you have a tad less battery and waiting for a new one or a spare one to finish your race on etc etc.
When overhauling an engine you're left with a handfull of scrap metal. However we do keep some parts like pistons and frictions plates for that ''just in case'' box that always accomanies us in the van. But those are pretty much a ''worst case scenario''.

 

[UKLee]

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Then see my comments that you need a 2 year warranty with the stark as one issue after another, it is in a dealers now with a big list of issues, run many Yamaha mx and enduro bikes and can not think of a single issue that would come under a warranty claim.

Then add in the cost of taking the stark to events only for it to decide it does not want to turn on or connect with the phone or will not take a charge so wasted day enrty fee transport etc, Happened many times.

Sorry but all these things added up the ICE bike blows the stark out of the water as far as cost per hours riding goes, Even more when you go to an enduro practice day and no reason you could not ride the ICE bike all 6 hours if you wanted be lucky to get 2.5 hours from the stark the rest it needs to be on charge in fact now they dropped the maximum charging from 3.3kw to 2.7kw it would be even worse than that.

The only good thing about the stark and the only reason we still have it is because it is Quiet and we can use it in a field behind the houses.... well that is if decides it actully wants to work, these days we check it will power up and turn the back wheel before getting our riding gear on.

 

[Erwin P]

You sure have a problem bike, wich is really bad don't get me wrong, but that happens with all brands.
A guy at out local MX track has a YZ250F that has been nothing but trouble since he got it. Does that make Yamaha a bad brand? Not to me since there a many Yamaha's doing fine, but by your logic it does.

I could give you plenty of examples from KTM, Beta, Sherco, Honda, Kawasaki, TM, Rieju etc etc. But you get the point. Some bikes have some ''random'' issues and leave you stranded all the time.

I have a Beta 300 that has troubled me for months. Only when i took it out of the dealers hands and into mine i found the jetting was way to lean (stock from factory while they do provide the dealers with a jetting map per altitude/temperature) and the starter cable scratching the exhaust and cause a short circuit everytime i pressed start while the exhaust washot.
Is Beta a bad brand for that or was it just a bad dealer?

In the end there is not that much on a Stark. You have a Powertrain, VCU, battery, a map switch and a very simple wiring harnas. Replace those 1 by one and any problem should be found in 1 afternoon. If the dealer can't find it it's a rather poor dealer.
I know for a fact Stark supplies their dealers with those parts so everything should be there to do a quick fault finding.

 

[rs911]

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Sorry but you're wrong comparing the prices this way, you should only be comparing MSRP.
If some companies offers better prices by cutting their margins, then it's good for the customer but that's it.

You might be able to find a better price on a new bike at some dealers, but since it's more exclusive, it's not as common.
I'm sure you could have great prices on "older MX 1.0" destock deals but you can reuse that special price for comparison...

And the truth is that, for example, the time in which you hear a weird noise from the right side of the engine and you remove the right side cranckcase cover, if the gasket breaks and sticks in part on one side and in part on the other you may need to spend like 10 € for a new one and 2 hours of your time just to locate and replace some 2 € worn washer behind the clutch basket, even though people would then describe it as a 10 minutes job whereas in ten minutes they had just drained the oil and gathered the tools.
Piston inspection on a 4 stroke? Well, even if the piston, when measured, is still useable, you have to replace the expensive, non reuseable, head gasket.
And so on, there are so many things that one could consider.
Personally I had fun doing maintenance in the first years of riding, then it became less and less interesting and rewarding and I started feeling like still being at work when doing it.
That's the main reason for which I wanted the Varg and so far I'm satisfied because with an ICE I would have surely done much more maintenance by now.


Just when you do the math remember that the battery is expected to surely lose capacity at some point and when its capacity will be below your acceptable limits, as far as I've understood, it won't be covered by the warranty if it still works.

Same here, I love working on bikes and cars but I really dislikes doing maintenance, sometimes I even prefer to pay someone to do it...
It's like cooking, I'd rather spend hours in the garage than cooking

 

[UKLee]

Sorry but you're wrong comparing the prices this way, you should only be comparing MSRP.
If some companies offers better prices by cutting their margins, then it's good for the customer but that's it.

You might be able to find a better price on a new bike at some dealers, but since it's more exclusive, it's not as common.
I'm sure you could have great prices on "older MX 1.0" destock deals but you can reuse that special price for comparison...



Same here, I love working on bikes and cars but I really dislikes doing maintenance, sometimes I even prefer to pay someone to do it...
It's like cooking, I'd rather spend hours in the garage than cooking

It is not older it is the latest model available right now, the 1.2 is the latest stark. you work it out however you want but for me it is what is going out of my pocket that matters.
Besides the official dealers are only allowed to advertise prices agreed with the importer but we all know speak to them no PX and every chance you will get it for less especially if the 26 is due soon.

 

[OpaTsupa]

I've seen Varg MX 1.0 for 9.999€ from a few dealers.
Probably there will now be more at that price to clear room for 1.2 model.

 

[DaveAusNor]

Even Stark website has some pretty good deals right now too.

 

[markhamr]

1.0there 15k here
pre order 1.2 is 21k

 

[Erwin P]

The 1.2 is introduced this week. Sure there is no discount.
However laat week the 1.0 was the latest model and was discounted around 9500 euro for a 60hp wich compares to a YZ450.

 

[UKLee]

You sure have a problem bike, wich is really bad don't get me wrong, but that happens with all brands.
A guy at out local MX track has a YZ250F that has been nothing but trouble since he got it. Does that make Yamaha a bad brand? Not to me since there a many Yamaha's doing fine, but by your logic it does.

I could give you plenty of examples from KTM, Beta, Sherco, Honda, Kawasaki, TM, Rieju etc etc. But you get the point. Some bikes have some ''random'' issues and leave you stranded all the time.

I have a Beta 300 that has troubled me for months. Only when i took it out of the dealers hands and into mine i found the jetting was way to lean (stock from factory while they do provide the dealers with a jetting map per altitude/temperature) and the starter cable scratching the exhaust and cause a short circuit everytime i pressed start while the exhaust washot.
Is Beta a bad brand for that or was it just a bad dealer?

In the end there is not that much on a Stark. You have a Powertrain, VCU, battery, a map switch and a very simple wiring harnas. Replace those 1 by one and any problem should be found in 1 afternoon. If the dealer can't find it it's a rather poor dealer.
I know for a fact Stark supplies their dealers with those parts so everything should be there to do a quick fault finding.

"I know for a fact Stark supplies their dealers with those parts so everything should be there to do a quick fault finding."
That is what I thought and what stark seemed to imply but the dealer tells me the VCU they need to try has to be coded to my bike so over a week later it has now arrived, This is another problem every time there is a problem stark take for ever to reply to a message of get parts sent out, suits them the longer it takes to get it back up and running the longer before the next problem, the closer it gets to the end of the warranty period.

 

[Beagle]

It is not older it is the latest model available right now, the 1.2 is the latest stark. you work it out however you want but for me it is what is going out of my pocket that matters.
Besides the official dealers are only allowed to advertise prices agreed with the importer but we all know speak to them no PX and every chance you will get it for less especially if the 26 is due soon.

Latest model available is the 26 at £9600.

Of course there are rebates on the 25 YZ450F, just like the MX1.0 is £1200 cheaper than MX1.2.