Anti-Theft?!

[Foss]

I’m not so easily accepting of stuff like that….also not sure what any of this means….a 2 stroke has more than 1 hp. As does an alta. How you have to choose between a horse or every breath being monitored with no middle Ground makes no sense. There were no years between 1873 and 2024…? Not sure I understand your logic….seems more like a coping mechanism to down play anyone concerned with where this could take us.

I was asking if anyone has opened the VCU up and experimented with bike operation outside of 4g connection.

Thanks for the “just lay down and take it…its easier that way…”speech hahah I feel a lot stronger now

When you start having days you aren’t allowed to drive so your electric car is shut down or your dirt bike won’t work unless in “designated area” you’ll prob still have some funny jokes!

I can tell you this @Swank171 everything I have opened so far from Stark, has been poured with a liquid silicone or rubber material which I am sure they call their “water proof” rating. But to be honest it’s just a way to prevent people from reverse engineering their hardware. I could put these items in an oven and slowly melt the material but it is a long process and could weaken solder points. It’s not easy, and I am going to guess the VCU has something very similar to this.

 

[blbills]

Following. Interested if someone cracks this open to investigate further. Don't like the idea of big brother knowing everything I'm doing.

 

[Kurlon]

I can tell you this @Swank171 everything I have opened so far from Stark, has been poured with a liquid silicone or rubber material which I am sure they call their “water proof” rating. But to be honest it’s just a way to prevent people from reverse engineering their hardware. I could put these items in an oven and slowly melt the material but it is a long process and could weaken solder points. It’s not easy, and I am going to guess the VCU has something very similar to this.

Conformal coatings are pretty standard across multiple industries, as is potting, and they do approximately nothing to slow down reverse engineering. They can be removed with the right application of chemicals leaving no trace, and no damage to the underlying boards.

 

[Beagle]

Following. Interested if someone cracks this open to investigate further. Don't like the idea of big brother knowing everything I'm doing.

Then I hope you're not writing this from a smartphone

 

[Foss]

Conformal coatings are pretty standard across multiple industries, as is potting, and they do approximately nothing to slow down reverse engineering. They can be removed with the right application of chemicals leaving no trace, and no damage to the underlying boards.

Yea I am no expert but it is an observation I have seen so far opening up the power adapter and wireless charging/BT dongle. I am sure with some guidance on how to go about what materials are needed and techniques used I could next time provide photos.

 

[Swank171]

Well….im very well versed in motor building and fabrication….but someone is gonna have to help me on what I’m looking at here….

The sticker band at the top inside says “gps” and “lte”. I can trace them to the board but don’t wanna damage them. I’d be okay with disconnecting until I need stark to troubleshoot something and then reconnect if needed.

I’ll prob mess with it but I thought I’d come here for some more experienced people to chime in with the WiFi stuff. I’m new on this scene….

 

[Theo]

I think that disassembling that stuff can create a problem: moist air can enter those components and then, when the temperature will go below the dew point, there will be condensation. I have wondered how to prevent condensation in the battery etc. and I have come to the conclusion that they seal those components in dry environments so that the dew point inside them becomes as low as possible; until they are sealed, moist air won't enter them.

@ Swank171: If I were in your shoes, I would put the Varg in a room with a dehumidifier on, remove as much moisture as possible and only then I would close that lid.

 

[Swank171]

I think that disassembling that stuff can create a problem: moist air can enter those components and then, when the temperature will go below the dew point, there will be condensation. I have wondered how to prevent condensation in the battery etc. and I have come to the conclusion that they seal those components in dry environments so that the dew point inside them becomes as low as possible; until they are sealed, moist air won't enter them.

@ Swank171: If I were in your shoes, I would put the Varg in a room with a dehumidifier on, remove as much moisture as possible and only then I would close that lid.

It wasn’t a nitrogen filled component. Haha. Besides it had sweat in the inside of the lid to begin with, must have been put together in a room without a dehumidifier.

I think I’ll live with any air that gets in….you might be on to something. maybe if I fill it with water it’ll disable the 4G and I won’t have a bike that tracks every fart.

 

[rayivers]

Thanks for the pix! The arc-shaped antenna array at the top handles both GPS and LTE/4G, they will effectively vanish without it. It might be possible to unplug (can't see clearly) or unsolder the cable to the 'LTE' connection, but this removes the load from the microwave transceiver which I would not do without print/specs in hand.

If this were my bike I wouldn't touch anything in there (see below though), but when the cover's back on I'd wrap as much of the outside /every side of the plastic VCU box with regular grocery-store aluminum foil, just for testing (imagine you're trying to make it waterproof). I'm not sure how to test it's effectiveness without access to VCU signal-strength data, but it would be interesting if updating became impossible, indicating that's probably done directly thru the VCU and not the Stark phone (just a guess). It would also be great if GPS data was still available for the ride/speed/distance displays thru the phone, as it should be.

I agree about humidity - some Altas had problems with it - so I'd install a properly-sized (i.e., neither jammed in nor flopping around) non-conductive dessicant pack under the bottom PCB; maybe w/some open-cell foam here and there it to limit its motion while still allowing it to 'breathe'.

 

[Swank171]

the band definitely got me. I saw it and immediately thought. “Nah” haha. I can see where it’s plugged into the board but I wasn’t committed enough to unplug it.

The “faraday” box with the foil is an interesting thought. I’ll prob try that….i can’t sit still so random stuff like this usually turns into something more for me hahah.

 

[Beagle]

You know Anton said they would stop paying the data plan for the Sim so soon the bike won't communicate anymore... unless you pay for the premium subscription.
Don't pay, problem solved

 

[Torqu3]

Well….im very well versed in motor building and fabrication….but someone is gonna have to help me on what I’m looking at here….

The sticker band at the top inside says “gps” and “lte”. I can trace them to the board but don’t wanna damage them. I’d be okay with disconnecting until I need stark to troubleshoot something and then reconnect if needed.

I’ll prob mess with it but I thought I’d come here for some more experienced people to chime in with the WiFi stuff. I’m new on this scene….

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Thanks for posting this. One thing to note is your gasket looks pinched and not in the channel on the right side. It looks like an assembly defect. I'd get some RTV on there before re assembling. I want to open mine up now to check the gasket integrity....especially since I've already had my bike in some deep water.....

 

[AL_V]

Thanks for posting this. One thing to note is your gasket look pinched and not in the channel on the right side. It looks like an assembly defect. I'd get some RTV on there before re assembling. I want to open mine up now to check the gasket integrity....especially since I've already had my bike in some deep water.....

Right! The gasket wasn’t in the groove on the right.

 

[Swank171]

Right! The gasket wasn’t in the groove on the right.

That is correct. It was absolutely not sealed correctly. I thought that was interesting. Haha.

A few other suspect things I’ve noticed in my travels around the bike…..I like to get into stuff but we will see in time if it’s an issue. If it is I’ll post it here for sure.

 

[rayivers]

You know Anton said they would stop paying the data plan for the Sim so soon the bike won't communicate anymore... unless you pay for the premium subscription.
Don't pay, problem solved

... unless the features you need are only available with the subscription.

 

[Beagle]

... unless the features you need are only available with the subscription.

Good point but at least those who are concerned about it would then have a choice to own the bike without fearing getting tracked. They'd be able to decide if they 'd rather have the full Monty or if they value more their privacy.

 

[rayivers]

My concern is (imho) far more critical than any privacy issue. Any vehicle whose control functions can be accessed via wireless network is vulnerable to (potentially lethal) unauthorized external manipulation.

 

[Torqu3]

My concern is (imho) far more critical than any privacy issue. Any vehicle whose control functions can be accessed via wireless network is vulnerable to (potentially lethal) unauthorized external manipulation.

Unlikely but possible. Without knowing more details about the architecture and associated safeguards we really can't do more than speculate.

 

[C5tor]

Well….im very well versed in motor building and fabrication….but someone is gonna have to help me on what I’m looking at here….

The sticker band at the top inside says “gps” and “lte”. I can trace them to the board but don’t wanna damage them. I’d be okay with disconnecting until I need stark to troubleshoot something and then reconnect if needed.

I’ll prob mess with it but I thought I’d come here for some more experienced people to chime in with the WiFi stuff. I’m new on this scene….

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It looks complicated, but I’m pretty sure that’s just a picture of where the base plate of the pre-famulated amulite is connected to the hyperencabulator. But Stark is really going for the old-school look of the retroencabulator without employing the asynchronistic flux of quintupular spurving bearings.

Here’s a better explanation:

 

[Swank171]

Honestly, I think it’s going to surprise us how fast we are going to start being restricted on where we’re allowed to ride these.

It’s already painfully obvious that the green and red sticker has nothing to do with emissions since it’s such a hassle to even be able to ride an electric bike in state parks in the state of California. Just wait until we are restricted on where we can ride or we can ride and these bikes or electric cars will just not work at all unless you’re inside specific boundaries or given days.

Anyone who thinks that this is not realistic, in our lifetime is crazy.