BEST Replacement Side Stand KIT?

[Chaconne]

Go and ride any Chinese Dirtbike. Their expensive ones for fair comparison.

They just can't seem to figure out how to make a proper riding one E or ICE.
The EXE880 is closest in the E market. The price gap is 2000, but in way of performance the gap is much wider.

I think they can easily match performance the question is do they want to. Kove is ok and CFMoto competes very well in markets they go after. CFMoto was rumored to be making parts for KTM.

Seems the Chinese motorcycle manufacturers are where the Japanese were 40 years ago but the market has changed and the volumes in the US and Europe just are not the same and don't appeal that much to a developing economy's growth curve. Plus, India and China have humongous internal markets of their own to serve which the Japanese never had.

 

[Erwin P]

They can easily match quality, that's not an issue. They do lack the experience from dozens of years of competition racing though.
And where they are matching quality and performance the bikes arn't that much cheaper either. Talked to a few dealers and the biggest chunk of the pricegap is in their margins, not on the actual price of the product they receive.
Kove has a OK bike, very good for its money but it still performs kinda budget compared to the Euro bikes.
CF isn't rumored to build KTM parts, they build the entire 790/890 platforms. However on KTM designs, not KTM slapping stickers on CF's.

 

[Chaconne]

They can easily match quality, that's not an issue. They do lack the experience from dozens of years of competition racing though.
And where they are matching quality and performance the bikes arn't that much cheaper either. Talked to a few dealers and the biggest chunk of the pricegap is in their margins, not on the actual price of the product they receive.
Kove has a OK bike, very good for its money but it still performs kinda budget compared to the Euro bikes.
CF isn't rumored to build KTM parts, they build the entire 790/890 platforms. However on KTM designs, not KTM slapping stickers on CF's.

Yes agreed. My guess is the Chinese will largely take a pass on dirtbikes and dirtbike racing unless it can appeal to developing markets. They and the Indians are looking for volume sales of manufactured goods. As it is now the Japanese pretty much make offroad bikes for high priced advertising in the US (like Honda) and KTM's collapse in Europe would be another reason for a reluctance to engage more fully in the dirt/ohv motorcycle market.

 

[Erwin P]

But the Japanese all but gave up on dirtbikes as well. The past decade has been bald new graphics if anything.

KTM's collapse was on everything except their dirtbikes though.
Dirtbikes are still a good high margin market, just one the Japanese pretty much forgot about.

 

[Chaconne]

But the Japanese all but gave up on dirtbikes as well. The past decade has been bald new graphics if anything.

KTM's collapse was on everything except their dirtbikes though.
Dirtbikes are still a good high margin market, just one the Japanese pretty much forgot about.

Dirtbikes have high margins because their volumes are abysmal in the US at least. Trailbikes have all but vanished for the average outdoor enthusiast in the US. They have been completely replaced by ATVs and SxSs and 4wheel OHVs.

The large growth in off road motorcycles in the US (60s, 70s, 80s) was when it was the only OHV Americans could buy/afford. By the mid 80s quads were coming and Americans left any real use of trail non motoX dirtbikes far behind. Japan had no real internal market for dirtbikes and was completely reliant on the American market which was beginning to fade by the 90s.

I think KTMs collapse was directly related to dirtbikes. Their management mistook a government funded bubble for real demand and they produced way more than the real economy could absorb --regarding the US at least.

Things might be different in Europe with its long deeply embedded off-road motorcycle culture. In the US we don't have that, all we have left is motocross, which is largely an advertising mechanism for Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki, and Suzuki to maintain brand awareness for their main products.

 

[Beagle]

KTM has been selling more street bikes than dirt bikes for a while, we don't have any details but I'd bet their overflowing stock was more street than dirt (plus the major deficit maker were their electric bicycles).

 

[Erwin P]

The nail in their coffin was them overproducing 2x the amount of steetbikes that they could sell in factorys they just build on borrowed money.
That could have become stock IF Europe didn't move over to Euro5+ wich the bikes didn't comply to.
Having 150.000 unsellable streetbikes in a warehouse is a bit of an issue.

 

[Chaconne]

The nail in their coffin was them overproducing 2x the amount of steetbikes that they could sell in factorys they just build on borrowed money.
That could have become stock IF Europe didn't move over to Euro5+ wich the bikes didn't comply to.
Having 150.000 unsellable streetbikes in a warehouse is a bit of an issue.

I bet they could sell them all quickly in India for low prices. Which is probably what Bajaj will do.

 

[Erwin P]

I bet they could sell them all quickly in India for low prices. Which is probably what Bajaj will do.

Not the 790/890/1390 the main part of the stock was build up from. Even at prices as low as the shipping costs for those big bikes the will be over the locals budgets.
There is only one market for that without Euro5+ and that is the allready flooded US.