Some info regarding US orders/deliveries

[mike91t]

Stark dealer in Flagstaff AZ just sent me info saying they had some for sale -

Are they old demo bikes?

 

[Swank171]

The funny thing is I think the customers who bought and are locked in to the previous price are the e ones getting screwed because stark couldn’t care less if we take our orders since in their eyes they lose 1k$ a unit and that was the majority of the orders.

I’m so irritated. I ordered Dec 17th and don’t even have the energy to type out my experience here. It’s nothing special….just echoes the other experiences shared here and it’s a joke. Stark has zero compassion for the early investor. I’ll buy an alta or build an ultra bee

 

[F451]

It really is a bummer. Stark is losing a lot of good will from early adopters and the folks they need the most, experienced e-dirt bike enthusiasts.

 

[Swank171]

It really is a bummer. Stark is losing a lot of good will from early adopters and the folks they need the most, experienced e-dirt bike enthusiasts.

I agree 100%

 

[Ethos]

The funny thing is I think the customers who bought and are locked in to the previous price are the e ones getting screwed because stark couldn’t care less if we take our orders since in their eyes they lose 1k$ a unit and that was the majority of the orders.

I’m so irritated. I ordered Dec 17th and don’t even have the energy to type out my experience here. It’s nothing special….just echoes the other experiences shared here and it’s a joke. Stark has zero compassion for the early investor. I’ll buy an alta or build an ultra bee

It has really soured me I admit. I was very defensive of Stark early on.
It wouldnt have taken much to keep good will, and I fear it will cost them in the long run.

I delayed my order and will likely not take delivery now - which is a huge swing for me in the last 2 years.
Being an early adopter comes with good and bad - but right now all the good has been sucked away while the bad just keeps getting worse.

 

[Ross Shafer]

Thus far, I've written to Stark a few times, responses have ranged from no reply at all to very timely, polite, slightly apologetic replies regarding the kerfuffle around deliveries. Indeed they say I must take delivery through a dealer due to US regulations (I can choose which...gee thanks). They also say that they cannot currently deliver bikes to California due to regulations....they did not offer any answer when asked how there are bikes here in California at my local dealer if they can't deliver them here. I told them that publishing or supplying us customers with documentation of said regulations might help with the dive in customer satisfaction.

I can't say for sure, but full disclosure and admission that they jumped the gun due to a lack of due diligence on their part might help some us maintain patience. Instead they just keep changing things with little or no explanation. They did tell me that they'd be making announcements that would give us more info on the mess they've caused. There's been plenty of time since that communication to do so, but thus far....zip.

I've been self-employed in manufacturing all my adult life (48 years) and am painfully aware that things can change on a dime and that its hard to be prepared for everything. When shit happens and plans have to change it is absolutely the manufacturers choice to offer full disclosure to the customers they've taken orders from or to say fuck it, we'll get to them when we can...or want. The latter seems to be Stark's decision.

Making things worse is the fact that, not even the dealers who obviously mean more to them than us customers who ordered early, know WTF is going on. The one dealer I spoke with told me I'd for sure get a bike sooner if I canceled my order with Stark and ordered from them. He could not however, answer whether I would still get the bike at the early adopter price....never even got a call back with an answer.

Will probably still take delivery as I have friends who will happily take it off my hands should I decide I don't want it. Not a good situation and Stark is really dropping the ball.

Merry Christmas y'all!

 

[F451]

I find it amazing, and completely baffling, that Stark apparently did not do their homework, or any homework, around what the regulations/laws are regarding selling and delivering customer bikes in the USA (and I assume other countries?) in probably their BIGGEST MARKET.

And that they were apparently completely unaware of the push back they were going to get from the local dealers and their lobbying organizations around trying to sell and deliver directly to customers in the USA.

Unfortunately for Stark and their USA customers, the USA has a confusing patchwork of state regulations/laws on top of any federal regulations/laws for importing and selling automobiles and motorcycles.

A couple of hours of research by any half way competent market analyst or sales professional would have shown them the challenges they were facing with their sales and delivery approach, its not like its some big secret here. Tesla has already been there done that, plenty of info about Tesla's experience out there.

When I ordered my Varg 2 years ago I didn't even consider whether they had all of this squared away, it never occurred to me that there would be any issues, I naively assumed that they knew what they were doing.

And now, as mentioned by many, their lack of communication and poor handling of the delivery issues is compounding the problem. Taking the whole situation from bad to worse.

This whole situation is a case study in how not to promise, and how not to deliver. Always: "Under promise and over deliver." The first rule of business, and life really.

I think they said they had something like 17,000 orders? Is that correct? I am wondering how many orders are getting cancelled?

 

[Smerwin43]

Currently haven't even got a reply back from this last week after confirming which dealer I would like to allocate my order to.
After seeing a post here that someone's order was expected in 6-8 weeks in January changing to a February-March timeframe I'm really thinking about just heading down to the dealer and getting myself a 450. Oh well. Guess we'll see.

Does the allocation process take a week or two for anybody else? Perhaps Christmas time has them worked to the bone? Seems really scummy that these early orders are being treated as such.

 

[Ethos]

How do the Chinese bikes pass regulations and are able to be shipped door to door - but a quality bike like the Varg cant?
Also - California sucks.

 

[F451]

How do the Chinese bikes pass regulations and are able to be shipped door to door - but a quality bike like the Varg cant?
Also - California sucks.

I wonder if the Chinese bikes are "flying under the radar", or using some other loophole to ship direct to consumers? Perhaps the OEM's and dealers in the USA do not see the Chinese bikes as serious competition so they have not been raising a stink about them? But for the Varg, they see the thousands of orders, the quality of the bike, the investments into the company, and are fearing the competition and the direct to consumer business model, and now they are doing everything they can to slow/stop Varg from doing business outside of the traditional dealership model in the USA?

Besides the Varg, if the USA dealers and the major m/c OEM's y are burying their heads in the sand about the Chinese bikes (e-bikes and ICE) like they did with the Japanese market cars and bikes in the 60's-70's, they better wake up or they are going to get spanked all over again by Chinese imported product.

 

[Ethos]

I wonder if the Chinese bikes are "flying under the radar", or using some other loophole to ship direct to consumers? Perhaps the OEM's and dealers in the USA do not see the Chinese bikes as serious competition so they have not been raising a stink about them? But for the Varg, they see the thousands of orders, the quality of the bike, the investments into the company, and are fearing the competition and the direct to consumer business model, and now they are doing everything they can to slow/stop Varg from doing business outside of the traditional dealership model in the USA?

Besides the Varg, if the USA dealers and the major m/c OEM's y are burying their heads in the sand about the Chinese bikes (e-bikes and ICE) like they did with the Japanese market cars and bikes in the 60's-70's, they better wake up or they are going to get spanked all over again by Chinese imported product.

There are way more surrons in the USA than Vargs.

 

[F451]

There are way more surrons in the USA than Vargs.

I realize that. But there are way more orders for the Varg then there are existing sales for Sur Ron's in the US I would wager.

I'm not sure the OEM's and traditional motorcycle dealerships consider the Sur Ron's serious competition yet. Most of them don't sell them and seem oblivious to the thriving sales for them here in the US.

The Varg on the other hand has been getting constant press and rave reviews since it was announced. Then the massive number of orders/deposits. I'm thinking that has gotten the attention of both the major OEM's and the US dealerships in a big way. Hence all the push back from selling direct to consumer, delivering direct to customers, and not allowing the bikes to race in AMA events.

The OEM's will do everything they can to thwart Stark and the dealerships want to make sure they are not left out of the profit taking. And now we're all being forced to go through dealerships to take delivery of the bikes.

 

[Fog 25]

I remember, hearing that Ktm threatened to pull franchise license from dealers first signed up with Stark about a year ago.
In California they are saying to send your oder out of state. Heard dealers are charging anywhere from $200-$1200 in handling and service fees. Plus the extra expense of traveling out of state to pick up a unit. Not a great feeling from original contract. And a bad look for Stark. Stark is it getting out of their lane and trying to brach out before they can even straighten out the delivery debacle.

 

[Smerwin43]

Hopefully if order gets allocated to a dealer I won't be waiting this long. EARLY December 16th order. Can't believe this garbage.

 

[Swank171]

View attachment 10784

Hopefully if order gets allocated to a dealer I won't be waiting this long. EARLY December 16th order. Can't believe this garbage.

I’m December 17 2021 and got pushed to April 14. Sounds like they are pushed to dealer no matter what and this is the best we can hope for at this point

 

[Swank171]

I realize that. But there are way more orders for the Varg then there are existing sales for Sur Ron's in the US I would wager.

I'm not sure the OEM's and traditional motorcycle dealerships consider the Sur Ron's serious competition yet. Most of them don't sell them and seem oblivious to the thriving sales for them here in the US.

The Varg on the other hand has been getting constant press and rave reviews since it was announced. Then the massive number of orders/deposits. I'm thinking that has gotten the attention of both the major OEM's and the US dealerships in a big way. Hence all the push back from selling direct to consumer, delivering direct to customers, and not allowing the bikes to race in AMA events.

The OEM's will do everything they can to thwart Stark and the dealerships want to make sure they are not left out of the profit taking. And now we're all being forced to go through dealerships to take delivery of the bikes.

This rings some bells on the OEM mafia and ama execution of Alta.

The swamp is deep!!

 

[Swank171]

Stark dealer in Flagstaff AZ just sent me info saying they had some for sale -

This is where I wonder if stark can allow us to have a discount on this unit through the dealer to honor the early customers or if we have to wait for the bike with our name on it in 5 months. I mean the order gets cancelled and spit to the dealer and we pay the dealer….what difference does it make…? Just that we are locked in at a discount so we. Ow have to wait?

 

[F451]

This is where I wonder if stark can allow us to have a discount on this unit through the dealer to honor the early customers or if we have to wait for the bike with our name on it in 5 months. I mean the order gets cancelled and spit to the dealer and we pay the dealer….what difference does it make…? Just that we are locked in at a discount so we. Ow have to wait?

That's the latest rub for the early order peeps. Wait on your early order bike at the original price and get it who knows when?

Or cough up the coin for a higher priced bike and get it within a few weeks?

That's a good idea to offer that dealership allocated inventory to the early order folks at the original sale price. It would go a long way to smoothing ruffled feathers. Stark might have to take a small financial hit on each bike, but it seems like the fair thing to do.

If their pre-order numbers are accurate, and with their recent investment capital reports are true (no reason to believe they are not), it seems like a small investment for Stark to make to re-coup their lost credibility and customer good will.

Sadly, I'm sure they're not going to do that.

 

[Redbull]

Or you could just cancel your order and instead give them hundreds (possibly thousands) of dollars for an axe.

 

[Swank171]

Or you could just cancel your order and instead give them hundreds (possibly thousands) of dollars for an axe.

View attachment 10785

You’ll receive it via message in a bottle. It’ll ship sometime in 2027.