Broken display - solution?

[privateer703]

You want to take it apart and get some close ups of the insides?

 

[SuburbanDad]

You want to take it apart and get some close ups of the insides?

https://photos.app.goo.gl/tjiN7Xn1TR365GRw6
https://photos.app.goo.gl/9GQ1o8FVkDzNQDbi6

lmk, if there is something specific you want closer shot of

 

[Silent But Dirty]

You really did a number on it!

 

[John Lindemann]

No I don’t have the old display. Here’s pics of my remount to a safer location behind the handlebars. I used 1”x1/16” aluminum angle from Lowe’s and made the mount using, hammer, hacksaw, 6” bench vise and a handheld drill. Took me 2-3 hours to construct.

 

[Oded]

https://photos.app.goo.gl/tjiN7Xn1TR365GRw6
https://photos.app.goo.gl/9GQ1o8FVkDzNQDbi6

lmk, if there is something specific you want closer shot of

Thanks!

 

[bluefxstc]

https://photos.app.goo.gl/tjiN7Xn1TR365GRw6
https://photos.app.goo.gl/9GQ1o8FVkDzNQDbi6

lmk, if there is something specific you want closer shot of

How is the display attached to the board? If it is just the 20 solder connections on the edge of the display, then it would not be to dificult to replace the display if you can find a replacement. Kind of depends on if you damaged the board or if taking out he display also took out other components on the board.

 

[Silent But Dirty]

How is the display attached to the board? If it is just the 20 solder connections on the edge of the display, then it would not be to dificult to replace the display if you can find a replacement. Kind of depends on if you damaged the board or if taking out he display also took out other components on the board.

That board is definitely a goner. Some of the components are broke in two!

 

[bluefxstc]

That board is definitely a goner. Some of the components are broke in two!

Not sure that is true. The display is shot, no question, but the back of the board doesn't look bad. There may be a crack in it (uper/center section of board), but it is hard to tell in the picture. If the board is ok, then it may be possible to fix it by replacing the display.

 

[Silent But Dirty]

Not sure that is true. The display is shot, no question, but the back of the board doesn't look bad. There may be a crack in it (uper/center section of board), but it is hard to tell in the picture. If the board is ok, then it may be possible to fix it by replacing the display.

 

[bluefxstc]

Well that sucks.

 

[Philip]

No I don’t have the old display. Here’s pics of my remount to a safer location behind the handlebars. I used 1”x1/16” aluminum angle from Lowe’s and made the mount using, hammer, hacksaw, 6” bench vise and a handheld drill. Took me 2-3 hours to construct.

View attachment 1465

View attachment 1466

View attachment 1467

Could you please post a side view?

 

[Ben990]

I am posting this for a friend. He has a 2018 Alta Redshift MXR, and the display broke in a crash. Here is a pic of the display now:



The bike still works fine, but you can't read anything off of the display, which makes things inconvenient. Does anyone know yet if just the LCD panel of the display be replaced? Does anyone know the manufacturer of the LCD panel?

 

[snydes]

Does anyone know yet if just the LCD panel of the display be replaced? Does anyone know the manufacturer of the LCD panel?

The short answers are no and no. Unfortunately your friend is in an elite group of the unlucky right now.

 

[snydes]

I bought one of those Fasst Company's Flexx Hanglebars a few months ago. The Alta can feel a bit heavy on choppy and on sand tracks, so I thought a flexible bar could help.

View attachment 1394

I have not installed it yet. I wanted to make sure that the forks work well before I start messing with the handlebars. But now I am thinking I should install it sooner. The dash almost fits between the two cross-bars. If they are spread out by just 1mm, the dash can be dropped right in between them.

Fasst guys made a special pad for me with a cutout for the dash. But the dash still sits somewhat above the cross bars. I am thinking I will look for a way to drop it lower. They offered to machine the cross bars just a bit, thin them out, but at that time I did not think it was urgent. Now I am thinking differently.

This is the best avenue to pursue for display protection IMO.

 

[snydes]

Also, it's my understanding that someone who is electronics capable may possibly be able to make a CAN bypass that would allow the bike to function without the display in the CAN loop. This would only be a band-aid fix for a bike that doesn't function with a broken display.

 

[bluefxstc]

If your bike is still operational, I would leave it alone. The control unit/display is required for the bike to operate and if you mess with it to fix the display you may inadvertently break the control unit part of the device and leave the bike non operational. If the bike is not operational, then as @snydes stated you may be able to build a CAN bypass (probably just a 120Ω resistor) or someone with some electronics/soldering experience may be able to fix the display. If the bike is not operational, you have nothing to lose, you can't make it worse than it already is. Repairing depends on what is broken on/in the display. If it is a non programmed component, we should be able to replace it and hopefully fix the display. If it is a component that is programmed by connection to an Alta computer/server, we are currently out of luck as we have no way to reprogram the display after it is repaired.

 

[Philip]

If it is a non programmed component, we should be able to replace it and hopefully fix the display. If it is a component that is programmed by connection to an Alta computer/server, we are currently out of luck as we have no way to reprogram the display after it is repaired.

One thing confuses me. The owner (forgot who that was, sorry) received a replacement display, but he still couldn't ride until he went to the dealer to either program or initialize it. Does it then mean it is more complex than soldering in a resistor?

 

[bluefxstc]

One thing confuses me. The owner (forgot who that was, sorry) received a replacement display, but he still couldn't ride until he went to the dealer to either program or initialize it. Does it then mean it is more complex than soldering in a resistor?

Probably. First I am not an expert in this. I have done some work/studying with CAN on EV conversions, but I am not a programmer. I also don't know how the Alta is configured. Everything here is an educated guess. CAN does have a 120Ω termination requirement. Not sure what would happen to the bikes CAN bus if the 120Ω termination in the display is missing. It is possible that the lack of the 120Ω termination could cause bus to fail and the bike to also fail. I think it is more likely that the display has some control/communication functions, that if it is missing, the bike is inoperable. Most CAN commands send something out and expect something back. If CAN commands are being sent to the display, and the display doesn't answer, the bike probably shuts down. The vehicle control unit doesn't know what to do without an answer so it just doesn't do anything. Here is an example of the CAN requirements for the standard Alta charger from the Elcon FAQs.

"If your Elcon PFC charger has been programmed for CAN Bus control and you received a CAN Bus adapter with your charger, pin 1 of the adapter must be connected to CAN-Lo from your BMS and pin 2 to CAN-Hi. If your BMS does not already have a 120 ohm termination resistor across CAN-Lo and CAN-Hi, you will need to add one. The charger expects to receive every second a message from the BMS with CAN ID 1806E5F4 and 8-byte data with the voltage and current requested. If the charger doesn't receive a valid CAN message in 5 seconds, it stops charging until it receives a valid CAN message. The charger sends out every second a CAN status message with voltage, current and status information. Up to 4 chargers with different CAN IDs 1806E5F4, 1806E7F4, 1806E8F4 and 1806E9F4 can be connected to the same CAN bus and be controlled by one BMS".

From this you can see why the Alta fast charger will not charge any faster on a bike that originally came with a standard charger, without a software upgrade. The charger expects the bike to tell it how much current to send it. If the bike tells it to send the standard chargers current rating, the fast charger sends that. The charger will only provide the current level that the bike requests, not what the charger is capable of. You can also see that the charger shuts down if it doesn't get a response from the bike. I suspect that something is similar is happening with the display. The bike sends info to the display and expects a response. If it doesn't receive the response, it shuts down, waiting for a response that will never come if the display is broken.

My guess, at a minimum the dealer needs to tell the display what kind of bike it is on and update the odometer to ensure you can't get a 0 mile bike when you purchase a new display. There may also be slightly different programming on the display between the different models that needs to be updated. Probably minimal, but without programming/initializing the display, It will not work on the bike so the bike is also inoperable.

 

[privateer703]

We had someone completely destroy their display, if they were up for it we could either send the display to a company to be completely reverse engineered (this would probably be expensive). Or at a minimum someone could try and de-solder the display from the board and see if they can determine the type/model/mfr. I would think if you could identify the correct replacement, simply soldering a new display on shouldn't require any software update. However I do think it might be time to look into sending an intact display to a company to be reverse engineered. We also need an aluminum housing to protect it.

 

[datadog]

One thing confuses me. The owner (forgot who that was, sorry) received a replacement display, but he still couldn't ride until he went to the dealer to either program or initialize it. Does it then mean it is more complex than soldering in a resistor?

Could possibly be. Since the display is part of the CAN bus, and the odometer/hours reading is stored in the ACM, in certain instances it will be necessary to plug into the diagnostic laptop to initialize the display. Adding a termination resistor probably won't work. I've never tried it, but I know that the ACM will want to communicate with the display and expect a response, else no drive. There may be other ways to spoof the network, but a resistor is not the likely solution.