NEW! STARK VARG EX is here!

[Beagle]

Another interesting interview with Anton

Itw Anton Wass (boss de Stark Future) : "Nos concurrents dorment..." - Moto-Station

Il intrigue certains. Agace d’autres… Jeune patron de Stark Future, Anton Wass veut faire de son modèle « électrique » un succès majeur dans l’univers des deux roues. Après la cross, voilà l’enduro EX… Avant des modèles de route. Qui est Anton Wass ? Où va-t-il ? On est allé le retrouver à...

moto-station.com

12ft is your friend

Stark sold almost 1000 bikes in France, as a reference, Honda sells about 1200 CRF (total for CRF450R, 250R and 150R) a year here. I think people really underestimate how quickly Stark has become a significant player.
And they expect more sales from enduro which is a bigger market than MX.

 

[UKLee]

Another interesting interview with Anton

Itw Anton Wass (boss de Stark Future) : "Nos concurrents dorment..." - Moto-Station

Il intrigue certains. Agace d’autres… Jeune patron de Stark Future, Anton Wass veut faire de son modèle « électrique » un succès majeur dans l’univers des deux roues. Après la cross, voilà l’enduro EX… Avant des modèles de route. Qui est Anton Wass ? Où va-t-il ? On est allé le retrouver à...

moto-station.com

12ft is your friend

Stark sold almost 1000 bikes in France, as a reference, Honda sells about 1200 CRF (total for CRF450R, 250R and 150R) a year here. I think people really underestimate how quickly Stark has become a significant player.
And they expect more sales from enduro which is a bigger market than MX.

I would think most riders of current enduro bikes will find the stark enduro useless because of range (less than half maybe a third with the bigger standard enduro tanks) and the fact the current ice enduro bikes can refuel in seconds at any fuel station or pit stop. The stark will take at best 2 hours to fully charge and that is if you have a 220v supply and the bulky charger to hand.

Once people see through all the marketing BS they will work out it is just not practical not even close. Hot swap battery and on bike charger would help but still not going to be as practical as an ICE bike.
I can honestly say after over a years ownership of a stark varg compared to an ice bike the only plus is the fact it is quiet and no air filters to change, it is no faster on track, it is unreliable, it is not allowed in all events, If the many issues we and many others have had continue after the end of the warranty period it is going to cost a fortune to keep running even compared to a modern 4 stroke and battery range is very poor as covered above.

That is my honest unbiased hands on opinion.

 

[Stark71]

Hi,

I really respect feedbacks like the one from UKLee cause it is based on real experience. For me it is not ICE vs Electric. For me it is more ICE + Electric and it depends on the personal needs and the use case. I am a Stark Varg owner since one absolutely issue free year. I am a hobby weekend hopper. I enjoy spending time with my boys and friends. Here in Germany noise is a very big issue and I am so happy that a company like Starkfuture made this product. My personal batterie is always empty before the stark battery is empty and recharge time is pretty equal. More and more tracks here in Germany allow electric additional ride time without reducing ICE time.

I also ordered additional the EX for my older son just because both of us having more fun AND I can ride this bike legal on public road. I sold my KTM 250TPI not because it was bad just because I have more fun with electric and we do it only because of that. This is a very individual decision and we should be happy that our great hobby gets additional options.

BTW this was my first post here in the forum . Happy to be here

regards

 

[svtride]

As with any EV vehicle, in my experience/observation where I live (central part of US), they are a supplementary addition to a household's ICE vehicle(s).
I’ve noted with many colleagues, neighbors, or friends that own/lease a BEV, their household also owns/leases an ICE vehicle. I’m sure there are BEV exclusive households but I’d wager they are a small minority.
The EX that I have on order will also fill a supplementary role. I also own a 300TPI 2T and 500 4T, both street legal. They too have their specific uses/benefits. I realize the range limit of EX but feel the other properties it brings to ownership is worth a try. We’ll see.

 

[Zraaap]

Hi,

I really respect feedbacks like the one from UKLee cause it is based on real experience. For me it is not ICE vs Electric. For me it is more ICE + Electric and it depends on the personal needs and the use case. I am a Stark Varg owner since one absolutely issue free year. I am a hobby weekend hopper. I enjoy spending time with my boys and friends. Here in Germany noise is a very big issue and I am so happy that a company like Starkfuture made this product. My personal batterie is always empty before the stark battery is empty and recharge time is pretty equal. More and more tracks here in Germany allow electric additional ride time without reducing ICE time.

I also ordered additional the EX for my older son just because both of us having more fun AND I can ride this bike legal on public road. I sold my KTM 250TPI not because it was bad just because I have more fun with electric and we do it only because of that. This is a very individual decision and we should be happy that our great hobby gets additional options.

BTW this was my first post here in the forum . Happy to be here

regards

I agree with a lot of what UKLee said as well. For me it was even a bit of a borderline decision on whether the EX would suit all of my riding needs.

And honestly the one area I know I'm going to have to borrow a buddies bike or still get a second ICE bike is for the sand dunes, which is my happy place. Based on what I've seen even the EX batteries will likely only last about an hour and fifteen minutes in the dunes. And usually I'm out there for hours only to come back for a snack, fuel up and get back out. Waiting for 2 hours with a generator would put a damper on things.

But a deciding factor for me is that I own property that backs up to the national forest and having the ability to get on a bike and quietly ride right off into the trails without disturbing neighbors or even going into the small town to go hunt down other trails and being street legal was huge. For this purpose, the EX is perfect for me.

If I was running Enduro races still this bike might still work but the idea of going on a Enduro ride from my door in the city for a day and having to find a spot to charge and bringing along a modified charging base might give me some range anxiety, at least initially.

 

[OpaTsupa]

Allow me to chime in from the perspective of a possible future owner.

I only ride Enduro, and currently have a nicely tuned 2021. Beta 300 Race.
I've been itching for a new machine for no better reason than to have some variety. After many years on a 2T, I was set on a big 4T, namely Beta 480.
Around that time the Varg EX was announced, and confused my plans.

On paper, the EX is perfect for my intended use. Range is not a concern since even my longest rides are no more than one tank of fuel: ~90km / 3h.
All the teething issues of first generation Vargs are somewhat understandable, and my impression is that the Factory stands behind the product. There are some horror stories reported, but main bearings still fail on ICE bikes that have been in development for decades.

While, in my view, there are some red flags regarding both company and the bike, what is holding me is the price.
I could get a Beta 480RR for ~10.000€ compared to over 14.000€ for the Varg EX. [I pay highest freight and import tax. Note the location]
Even with the cost of ownership over many, many years the math doesn't hold up. The difference, the deprecation and the risk is to great for my taste and budget.

One other thing is that I doubt there will be a delivery before the last quarter of 2025. if one was to enter the queue now.

 

[UKLee]

Allow me to chime in from the perspective of a possible future owner.

I only ride Enduro, and currently have a nicely tuned 2021. Beta 300 Race.
I've been itching for a new machine for no better reason than to have some variety. After many years on a 2T, I was set on a big 4T, namely Beta 480.
Around that time the Varg EX was announced, and confused my plans.

On paper, the EX is perfect for my intended use. Range is not a concern since even my longest rides are no more than one tank of fuel: ~90km / 3h.
All the teething issues of first generation Vargs are somewhat understandable, and my impression is that the Factory stands behind the product. There are some horror stories reported, but main bearings still fail on ICE bikes that have been in development for decades.

While, in my view, there are some red flags regarding both company and the bike, what is holding me is the price.
I could get a Beta 480RR for ~10.000€ compared to over 14.000€ for the Varg EX. [I pay highest freight and import tax. Note the location]
Even with the cost of ownership over many, many years the math doesn't hold up. The difference, the deprecation and the risk is to great for my taste and budget.

One other thing is that I doubt there will be a delivery before the last quarter of 2025. if one was to enter the queue now.

" On paper, the EX is perfect for my intended use. Range is not a concern since even my longest rides are no more than one tank of fuel: ~90km / 3h."

Well that confirms it, people are actully falling for what the salesmen tell them although he does say "on paper" which gives a glimmer of hope.
If you set it at 10 hp and rode at 10mph you might stand a chance but to ride it as you would ride an enduro bike on enduro terrain Fast, slow, hard acceleration up steep hills, through bogs, sand, deep ruts you have no chance of covering the same distance as an enduro bike will on one tank of fuel, about a third from what we can see.

 

[Beagle]

For cost of ownership it depends, how much is your Beta maintenance cost? Chain, tires, brake pads, suspensions... will be similar, how much do you pay for engine-related maintenance?

If you order today, Europe delivery is mid-April.

In your shoes I would not worry so much on delivery date nor cost of ownership (obviously the more you ride the more interesting electrics are). The range would make me think because it will vary much between riders and terrain. Are there any roads sections in you riding, what would be average speed and so on.

10 hp

Riders get 2-3 h at GNCC on the Varg. It all depends on rider's level, type of enduro and terrain.

Raw footage with Varg 6.5 kWh set at 48hp

Pro (Taddy ) 1h18 (42 km, 32 km/h average speed), amateur 2h19 (53 km, 23 km/h), beginner 3h (50 km, 17 km/h).
So on this kind of riding you can expect about 50 km, 2 to 3 hours with an average speed around 20 km/h.

Then if it becomes slower, harder, more technical, riding time will increase a lot.

On this course, Eddie Karlsson got 2h55min, amateurs over 5h (with Eddie finishing on the amateur bike)

 

[Oded]

Where I live (Israel), enduro is very popular.
most riders here are weekend warriors, riding for 2-4 hours (mostly gnarly rocky hard enduro), and using trailers to transfer the bikes.
for these application, the Stark is spot on.

I return home with about 40-50% battery capacuty left on my Alta Redshift, so the Strak will be even better.

I see on youtube what most US riders are reffering to as enduro and that's long flowy trails. in these conditions the Strak's range may pose a problem.

 

[OpaTsupa]

" On paper, the EX is perfect for my intended use. Range is not a concern since even my longest rides are no more than one tank of fuel: ~90km / 3h."

Well that confirms it, people are actully falling for what the salesmen tell them although he does say "on paper" which gives a glimmer of hope.
If you set it at 10 hp and rode at 10mph you might stand a chance but to ride it as you would ride an enduro bike on enduro terrain Fast, slow, hard acceleration up steep hills, through bogs, sand, deep ruts you have no chance of covering the same distance as an enduro bike will on one tank of fuel, about a third from what we can see.

I read your recent experience, and it's one that falls into 'horror' category.
Was your bike sickly from the start?

I don't expect anything to do exactly 'what it says on the tin', and I make allowance for Stark's sales pitch, but your estimation and experience is at the extreme edge.

I mention "~90km / 3h" as my personal maximum consistent with safety and survival. I ride in remote hills, and fuel discipline is the norm. Usual training ride is going up and down a hill for 5-6 laps totaling ~30km / 1.5h and average speed 15-20km/h.
While climbs demand hard acceleration, wheel spin etc., the decent is with closed throttle and full brakes. And that's 50% of total distance.



".. For cost of ownership it depends, how much is your Beta maintenance cost? Chain, tires, brake pads, suspensions... will be similar, how much do you pay for engine-related maintenance? "

Since you asked I'll put it here, although I don't mean to steer the conversation about myself.

I average around 60h per year with this bike. Coming up to full four years of ownership since new. Around 6.300km / 220h ; av.speed 28km/h.
I keep it tidy and do all the work myself. I recently serviced it and consider it as good as new.

- Petrol: ~1000€ + 200€ 2T oil.
- Gear oil, air filters and assorted lubricants: 200€
- Two Pistons, gaskets: = 300€
So that comes to ~1700€ over four years on strictly ICE related stuff.
[1€ = 1$ more or less]
Let's round it up to 500€$ per year.
Stark Varg EX would need to be flawless for eight years to neutralise the 4K price difference.

I was ready to pay the fools tax for a new, hyped toy, but I think they overpriced this bike.
Of course, it's not Stark but others who started asking +10.000$ for a dirt bike toy with life expectancy of five years.

 

[UKLee]

For cost of ownership it depends, how much is your Beta maintenance cost? Chain, tires, brake pads, suspensions... will be similar, how much do you pay for engine-related maintenance?

If you order today, Europe delivery is mid-April.

In your shoes I would not worry so much on delivery date nor cost of ownership (obviously the more you ride the more interesting electrics are). The range would make me think because it will vary much between riders and terrain. Are there any roads sections in you riding, what would be average speed and so on.

10 hp

Riders get 2-3 h at GNCC on the Varg. It all depends on rider's level, type of enduro and terrain.

Raw footage with Varg 6.5 kWh set at 48hp

Pro (Taddy ) 1h18 (42 km, 32 km/h average speed), amateur 2h19 (53 km, 23 km/h), beginner 3h (50 km, 17 km/h).
So on this kind of riding you can expect about 50 km, 2 to 3 hours with an average speed around 20 km/h.

Then if it becomes slower, harder, more technical, riding time will increase a lot.

On this course, Eddie Karlsson got 2h55min, amateurs over 5h (with Eddie finishing on the amateur bike)

You on comission?
You forgot to mention on many of these events they have a team of mechanics armed with battery nut guns to change the £2700 battery sometimes multiple times in an event.
You could not do that in a proper UK or even worldwide FIM timecard enduro because only the rider can work on the bike.

Also 1/2 hour riding and 2 1/2 hours posing for pro mo videos trying your best to look happy does not count as 3 hours riding.

 

[UKLee]

Where I live (Israel), enduro is very popular.
most riders here are weekend warriors, riding for 2-4 hours (mostly gnarly rocky hard enduro), and using trailers to transfer the bikes.
for these application, the Stark is spot on.

I return home with about 40-50% battery capacuty left on my Alta Redshift, so the Strak will be even better.

I see on youtube what most US riders are reffering to as enduro and that's long flowy trails. in these conditions the Strak's range may pose a problem.

Yes it seems some see enduro as what others would call trials on an enduro bike, made me think a few years ago I took my 3 kids to a trials practice area on trials bikes. I was not bothered but just took our Freeride electric to save me walking, I was suprised how long the battery lasted riding around on the freeride especially as my eldest took it off me and started doing some of the hardest stuff on it, suprised he did not break it in half to be honest but yes it does show very slow technical stuff makes the battery last longer.

Enduros we do yes have technical stuff but also have fire roads and even paved roads and once you get over 40 it soon starts draining the battery but you need to keep a good pace up or you loose time and arrive late at a check.

 

[UKLee]

I read your recent experience, and it's one that falls into 'horror' category.
Was your bike sickly from the start?

I don't expect anything to do exactly 'what it says on the tin', and I make allowance for Stark's sales pitch, but your estimation and experience is at the extreme edge.

I mention "~90km / 3h" as my personal maximum consistent with safety and survival. I ride in remote hills, and fuel discipline is the norm. Usual training ride is going up and down a hill for 5-6 laps totaling ~30km / 1.5h and average speed 15-20km/h.
While climbs demand hard acceleration, wheel spin etc., the decent is with closed throttle and full brakes. And that's 50% of total distance.



".. For cost of ownership it depends, how much is your Beta maintenance cost? Chain, tires, brake pads, suspensions... will be similar, how much do you pay for engine-related maintenance? "

Since you asked I'll put it here, although I don't mean to steer the conversation about myself.

I average around 60h per year with this bike. Coming up to full four years of ownership since new. Around 6.300km / 220h ; av.speed 28km/h.
I keep it tidy and do all the work myself. I recently serviced it and consider it as good as new.

- Petrol: ~1000€ + 200€ 2T oil.
- Gear oil, air filters and assorted lubricants: 200€
- Two Pistons, gaskets: = 300€
So that comes to ~1700€ over four years on strictly ICE related stuff.
[1€ = 1$ more or less]
Let's round it up to 500€$ per year.
Stark Varg EX would need to be flawless for eight years to neutralise the 4K price difference.

I was ready to pay the fools tax for a new, hyped toy, but I think they overpriced this bike.
Of course, it's not Stark but others who started asking +10.000$ for a dirt bike toy with life expectancy of five years.

As I said before hardly used it at first but once the weather picked up it got daily use in the field/track we have behind our house, I think it was about 30 hours before we started having major issues.

Believe me I was one of the people saying the stark has next to no running costs compared to an ice bike but in reality that is not the case and that is before the warranty runs out.

 

[Beagle]

You on comission?
You forgot to mention on many of these events they have a team of mechanics armed with battery nut guns to change the £2700 battery sometimes multiple times in an event.
You could not do that in a proper UK or even worldwide FIM timecard enduro because only the rider can work on the bike.

Also 1/2 hour riding and 2 1/2 hours posing for pro mo videos trying your best to look happy does not count as 3 hours riding.

Dude I'm saying 3h is doable, 90 km is probably a bit of a stretch (even if it depends on speed and terrain). As I posted 50 km should be fine.

@Opa: should be plenty for your 30 km 1.5 h training, might be able to double that but highly doubt you could triple this range. 4K difference is a lot, here it's more like 2K. You may not save much money or not at all but you would definitely save some time.

Lee, if you believe they stop for photos or switching the battery, just watch the 3 h or 5 h raw footage of them riding. Can't be more transparent than that, then it's up to each rider to see how it compares with their own riding.

Sure Eddie and Taddy have run some 3-6 h races while switching batteries, sure, they've also ran shorter enduro races on one battery. More to the point, proper non factory riders race 2-3 h races (GNCC, hare scrambles and the like) without access to a second battery.

 

[Chadx]

Sometimes there are discussions on making up the price difference between electric and ICE. What about those that don't really care about the price difference (at least within reason) and just want one? Yes there is a price difference, but it's not that much in the big picture of life.

A bit of 'operating cost' savings on oil, oil filter, air filter cleaner and oil, gas, etc. is nice, but for me, is incidental in the decision to ride electric along with my ICE bikes/ATVs. Saving the time by not doing that maintenance is a higher up my scale of benefits, especially since I still have so many other things to service (ICE bikes, ATVs, snowbike/snowmobile, pickup, SUV, boat outboard, etc.) so it's not like I don't have oil on my hands all year long. Ha.
But the biggest factor is, I just wanted it. And that is as good of a reason as any since these are toys and not must haves.

Range is still a real consideration, but simply, if it doesn't work for you, it doesn't work for you. Buy something that does. For those of us it works for, they are an option and we can weigh the other usual purchase decision points and either get it or not. Everyone has different uses cases and different specs they weight higher or lower. Evaluate and decide. No big deal.

Speaking of comparing:
2025 KTM 450 XCF-W: MSRP - $12,149USD (plus $650 destination)
2025 Yamaha YZ450FX: MSRP - $10,199USD (plus $600 destination)

$2,000USD difference between those two ICE bikes and people buy the KTM over the Yamaha just because they want to. Not like there is $2,000 more value in the KTM for a recreational rider. I'm all for just buying whatever you want. That could be because you read a spec, some reviewer said it was better even though you'd not be able to tell the difference, you've just always ridden that brand or you just like the color better. Emotion plays just as big of a role in the decision, which is great in my book. We are buying a toy so it should be the one that you prefer no matter the reason. Doesn't always have to be a 'dollar and cents' break-even calculation. If If it was, I wouldn't buy any dirtbike at all and would put that money into an appreciating asset or invest it elsewhere and die with more money. I'd rather go riding. Ha.

That being said, I only paid $9,965USD for my new 60hp Varg from the dealer last fall (which included $365 of tubes/tires installed so really $9,600USD for the Varg including destination and doc fee). That was a 60hp, red, 18" rear wheel, hand brake, sidestand. I got everything I wanted except the color gray. It was the same or cheaper than buying a new gas bike. It will depreciate a bit faster, but dirtbikes drop like rocks anyway so when I buy, I do it based on the value going to zero in four or five years and if I get anything back out of it when I sell, that is gravy. Cost of the sport.

I only managed four rides before there was too much snow so if I'd known the EX was coming out, I'd have waited to buy and gladly paid the $12,900USD (plus $299 destination) for that, compared to the $9,600USD I paid for mine, since it would be set up for how I ride; mountain forest service roads and single track (never will be on an MX track). And, the main mountain trails don't open until middle of June anyway, so no hurry. The EX has improved phone/cradle, wire harness, bigger battery, more programable features, better chain guard, better frame flex, head/tail/brake lights (which I like for being seen on the trails), and enduro suspension rather than MX.

As much as I want all those updates, most of those are nice-to-haves rather than must have so I decided to keep my Varg for at least the two years (until warranty is up) and then evaluate to see what is on the market then and how it compares (be that Varg EX or some other brand). Might change to a different brand or different Stark model then or just stick with my Varg if I have it dialed in how I want it.

For the $3,600 difference between my Varg and an EX, I'll update my suspension and add handguards and be good to go. I did order the lightest suspension when my weight would put me in the medium suspension, and with all clickers most of the way out, it rides perfect in the fast, aggressive trails, but still too firm for slow-paced, relaxed family/friends type riding. I like extremely plush for most of my riding and can live with 'too plush' for the days I ride hard with buddies.

But that is my take on the price difference between ICE and electric and making it up with lower operating costs. I don't care. I just wanted it. Ha.
And that is good enough for me.

And if price is a concern, there is still, temporarily, the option to go with the current Varg MX for cheaper than ICE. [Edit: though I do see they have again removed the option for a 60hp of the current Varg MX model and so starting price is now $10,999USD rather than $9,999USD).

 

[Philip]

Sometimes there are discussions on making up the price difference between electric and ICE. What about those that don't really care about the price difference (at least within reason) and just want one? Yes there is a price difference, but it's not that much in the big picture of life.

A bit of 'operating cost' savings on oil, oil filter, air filter cleaner and oil, gas, etc. is nice, but for me, is incidental in the decision to ride electric along with my ICE bikes/ATVs. Saving the time by not doing that maintenance is a higher up my scale of benefits, especially since I still have so many other things to service (ICE bikes, ATVs, snowbike/snowmobile, pickup, SUV, boat outboard, etc.) so it's not like I don't have oil on my hands all year long. Ha.
But the biggest factor is, I just wanted it. And that is as good of a reason as any since these are toys and not must haves.

In another comparison:
2025 KTM 450 XCF-W: MSRP - $12,149USD (plus $650 destination)
2025 Yamaha YZ450FX: MSRP - $10,199USD (plus $600 destination)

$2,000USD difference between those two ICE bikes and people buy the KTM over the Yamaha just because they want to. Not like there is $2,000 more value in the KTM. I'm all for just buying whatever you want. Doesn't always have to be a 'dollar and cents' break-even calculation. If it was, I wouldn't buy any dirtbike at all and would put that money into an appreciating asset or invest it.

That being said, I only paid $9,965USD for my new 60hp Varg from the dealer last fall (which included $365 of tubes/tires installed so really $9,600USD for the Varg including destination and doc fee). That was a 60hp, red, 18" rear wheel, hand brake, sidestand. I got everything I wanted except the color gray. It was the same or cheaper than buying a new gas bike. It will depreciate a bit faster, but dirtbikes drop like rocks anyway so when I buy, I do it based on the value going to zero in four or five years and if I get anything back out of it when I sell, that is gravy. Cost of the sport.

I only managed four rides before there was too much snow so if I'd known the EX was coming out, I'd have waited to buy and gladly paid the $12,900USD (plus $299 destination) for that, compared to the $9,600USD I paid for mine, since it would be set up for how I ride; mountain forest service roads and single track (never will be on an MX track). And, the main mountain trails don't open until middle of June anyway, so no hurry. The EX has improved phone/cradle, wire harness, bigger battery, more programable features, better chain guard, better frame flex, head/tail/brake lights (which I like for being seen on the trails), and enduro suspension rather than MX.

As much as I want all those updates, most of those are nice-to-haves rather than must have so I decided to keep my Varg for at least the two years (until warranty is up) and then evaluate to see what is on the market then and how it compares (be that Varg EX or some other brand). Might change to a different brand or different Stark model then or just stick with my Varg if I have it dialed in how I want it.

For the $3,600 difference between my Varg and an EX, I'll update my suspension and add handguards and be good to go. I did order the lightest suspension when my weight would put me in the medium suspension, and with all clickers most of the way out, it rides perfect in the fast, aggressive trails, but still too firm for slow-paced, relaxed family/friends type riding. I like extremely plush for most of my riding and can live with 'too plush' for the days I ride hard with buddies.

But that is my take on the price difference between ICE and electric and making it up with lower operating costs. I don't care. I just wanted it. Ha.
And that is good enough for me.

And if price is a concern, there is still, temporarily, the option to go with the current Varg MX for cheaper than ICE. [Edit: though I do see they have again removed the option for a 60hp of the current Varg MX model and so starting price is now $10,999USD rather than $9,999USD).

Exactly!

If both the ICE and the electric bike fit your needs for the riding time and the range, should everyone always buy the cheapest option? No!

How much value do you put on fun? How much value do you put on perfect throttle control, perfect power, no shifting, no clutching? No noise? Hearing the rear tire hooking up perfectly or roosting the dirt or gravel?

How much is your time and effort worth? Having to do filter cleanings, oil changes, top end changes or adjustments? That time is not free. Subtract the total cost of all the replacement oil, filters, and engine parts that you will use up over the lifetime of the bike from that €4,000 and then divide whether is left over the number of hours that you will be working in the garage servicing the ICE motor. That's how much value your are putting on your time. Most people do not enjoy this part of ICE bike ownership.

The resale value. Even Altas with 100+ hours on the clock are worth more than than equivalent gas bikes.

Many people choose not to own an ICE dirt bike at all. Hardcore guys, like Ryan Hughes, say they don't want to work on the bike themselves and do not trust the grease monkeys at the dealership to do the work for them. Plus, even delivering the bike to a dealer for service and maintenance is already a chore. With electric bikes all you have to do is wash the dirt off, keep air in the tires, and plug it into a power outlet.

 

[Theo]

should everyone always buy the cheapest option? No!

How much value do you put on fun? How much value do you put on perfect throttle control, perfect power, no shifting, no clutching? No noise? Hearing the rear tire hooking up perfectly or roosting the dirt or gravel?

How much is your time and effort worth? Having to do filter cleanings, oil changes, top end changes or adjustments? That time is not free. Divide that €4,000 over the number of hours over the lifetime of the bike that you will be working in the garage servicing the ICE motor. That's how much value your are putting on your time. Most people do not enjoy this part of ICE bike ownership.

I agree 100%. When buying a product for the joy of using it, you decide how much each of its features is worth.
I see this mistake a lot when people discuss about sportscars especially: they say things like "I want a certain model because it's 10% more powerful and 10% cheaper than another one" and it almost sounds like the company which makes the more expensive car is dishonest for that price. What if I love the look of the more expensive one? What if I love the handling? When you buy a sportscar or a dirtbike you are basically wasting money anyways under the strictly functional point of view, since you could move from point A to point B with way cheaper alternatives.
If you buy an air compressor, then ok, probably you just want the best bang for the buck, but even then it's pretty hard to assess the real value of something before having used it for some time. Maybe the more expensive compressor is more reliable or it's so quiet you can use it later in the evening.

 

[OpaTsupa]

What about those that don't really care about the price difference (at least within reason) and just want one?

Never worry, business plans of companies like Stark and KTM are built around that cohort.
Downside is that they will buy any well polished turd within reason, and prices will rise and quality decline.
You can ask KTM how is that working out at present.

 

[UKLee]

Never worry, business plans of companies like Stark and KTM are built around that cohort.
Downside is that they will buy any well polished turd within reason, and prices will rise and quality decline.
You can ask KTM how is that working out at present.

Ha Ha so true, could not have put it better myself

 

[Theo]

I average around 60h per year with this bike. Coming up to full four years of ownership since new. Around 6.300km / 220h ; av.speed 28km/h.
I keep it tidy and do all the work myself. I recently serviced it and consider it as good as new.

- Petrol: ~1000€ + 200€ 2T oil.
- Gear oil, air filters and assorted lubricants: 200€
- Two Pistons, gaskets: = 300€
So that comes to ~1700€ over four years on strictly ICE related stuff.
[1€ = 1$ more or less]
Let's round it up to 500€$ per year.
Stark Varg EX would need to be flawless for eight years to neutralise the 4K price difference.

I was ready to pay the fools tax for a new, hyped toy, but I think they overpriced this bike.
Of course, it's not Stark but others who started asking +10.000$ for a dirt bike toy with life expectancy of five years.

Maybe I'm more used to the maintenance schedule for motocross, but the cost estimate for your 2 stroke looks too optimistic to me.
If you do 50 h per year, can you just replace pistons for 400 h in eight years? I bought a 2001 YZ250 in 2016, so it was 15 years old. I don't know whehter the crankshaft had ever been replaced, but the conrod had radial play and the left journal had been spinning inside the bearing, so there was no interference with it and its diameter was 0.03 mm smaller than the new crankshaft I bought to replace it. Yes, your bike is much newer but crankshafts don't last forever; usually people say that every three pistons you replace the shaft. Same thing for the crankcase bearings; you'll replace them, then there are shifting forks which wear, gears from the gearbox which may not engage anymore after hundreds of hours. There are also smaller things like clutch discs, the muffler packings, and those things that break from time to time that you can't predict.

Plus, with the Stark it is possible that it will be flawless or that it won't be, while with a 2 stroke it's sure that you will need to do preventive maintenance and quite possible that you will need to do something aside the preventive maintenance and not everybody has fun trying to find the supposed air leak which is making the bike lean, for example. I personally find it crazy that, with ICE bikes, you need to be a mechanic just to be able to ride. At the beginning it was interesting and satisfying to do the maintenance, but after some years it started to be something which steals time to other stuff which has the priority, including riding itself.
BTW, in 50 hours my Stark has needed way less time and money spent on maintenance than my gas bikes and basically with it I've had fun without worries for an year. Others may have had different experiences but that's mine, so far. 8 years from now, I don't know.

On the other hand, if you are satisfied with you Beta and you have that opinion about the Stark, apparently the Stark is not for you, at least for now; you can still buy it or buy another electric motorcycle in the future, when prices will have changed (who knows how for sure?) and there will be more information about them.